Alliance war system

What do you want to see in the game? what can be improved? any suggestions welcome here...
Post Reply
User avatar
geisha
Forum Addict
Posts: 2810
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:28 pm
Race: Pastafarian
ID: 65545
Location: The beer volcano in FSM heaven

Alliance war system

I have suggested a similar thing ages ago, but I decided to give it another try.

I believe the game needs a system that makes wars winnable and that makes it possible to determine who wins a war and who loses it.

The reason why I think this is needed is because of the way the game has been evolving over the years. There are massive amounts of resources available nowadays and as a direct effect, everyone can afford to keep a war going for ever. There are no winners and no losers. I also believe that this is the reason the forums are going downhill. People get so frustrated with a game they can not win, that they start fighting a war of words on the forums instead and get quite personal and quite insulting. I can't even blame them and I am guilty myself but I think something can be done about this and it is a matter of game design.

So here is my suggestion:

Alliance wars are automatically triggered based on an alliance attacks on another alliance.

When alliance A uses more than a total of 1000 attack turns on at least 3 different members of alliance B within a period of 24 hours, A and B are automatically set to war. The reasons the 1000 turns have to be used on 3 or more members is to make sure that it wasn't just one member finding a nice raid target, but that it really was an act of hostility.

An alliance war lasts 4 weeks, during that period, nobody can join or leave the involved alliances and the alliances can not disband either.

After the 4 weeks, the victorious alliance is determined based on total damage done and on the total defence power remaining. The score system needs to be well conceived to make sure it is fair and can not be exploited. Since not all alliances have the same amount of resources to destroy, it would be unfair to base it only on total damage done. This is why I think it should also count in the defence an alliance is maintaining during the war. This makes sense because not removing the defences is clearly a failure of the other alliance.

When the winner has been declared, the two alliances are set to peace for a period of 2 weeks in which they can not attack each other. During that period nobody can leave or join the involved alliances either.

After that they can still repeat the process and give it another try but there will be no doubt about who has won the previous war.

During the 4 weeks period of war the alliance leaders can end the war early if they wish, all it takes is one alliance leader to click the surrender button and the other alliance leader to accept it. If they do that they skup right to the 2 weeks peace phase.
geisha
touched by his noodly appendage

Image

Image
dyslexic622
Forum Grunt
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:51 pm
ID: 29189
Location: Can't read signs to find out :'(

Re: Alliance war system

This is an incredibly awesome, in depth, and sophisticated way to war. I love it and fully support it's inception.
From a programming point of view it would be incredibly difficult however and would probably never be implemented.
ID: 29189
MSN: sukole@rpi.edu
AIM: dyslexic622
http://www.deckreations.com
User avatar
TacticalCommander
Forum Regular
Posts: 631
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:51 am
Race: Saige
ID: 8742
Location: somewhere.....elsewhere....anywhere

Re: Alliance war system

A good theory

geisha wrote:After the 4 weeks, the victorious alliance is determined based on total damage done and on the total defence power remaining. The score system needs to be well conceived to make sure it is fair and can not be exploited. Since not all alliances have the same amount of resources to destroy, it would be unfair to base it only on total damage done. This is why I think it should also count in the defence an alliance is maintaining during the war. This makes sense because not removing the defences is clearly a failure of the other alliance.


but unfortunately, people will simply bypass that defense one where on the last remaining days of the war, PPT as much as they can 4 -8 days depending on what day war was declared, and build a massive defense to make it look like they won the war.

add in that players can just attack a bunch, even if they are not technically massing anything just make it look like they are dealing more damage.


Ok...the first thing I would suggest is instead of total damage and defense power
a combination of ratios between
Units killed/Units loss
Naq stolen/Naq loss
UU raided/UU loss
Weapon value Sabbed/Weapon value loss
Planets stolen/Planets loss (or maybe a naq value of the planet)
MS volleys&shields destroyed/MS volley&shields loss

Whoever is killing more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
Whoever is stealing more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
Whoever is raiding more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
etc

Those 6 numbers are added together to get a score.

By factoring in naq stolen, uu raided, and since your spies will be ac'd (leaving you open to sabbing)if you don't have a defense, this will encourage people to build defenses in war.


I just need is a simple way to balance it out proportionally between big and small players as big players have more to lose, and small players have more take, if its even needed.


"An alliance war lasts 4 weeks, during that period, nobody can join or leave the involved alliances and the alliances can not disband either." Giesha

I would also like to know your rational reasoning behind this, simply because I disaggree and would like to know where your coming from before I debate it.


TC
Last edited by TacticalCommander on Mon Feb 25, 2008 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
GLORY TO THE GOD ALMIGHTY!
I am not being aggressive, I am being dominant.
Image
Image
User avatar
geisha
Forum Addict
Posts: 2810
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:28 pm
Race: Pastafarian
ID: 65545
Location: The beer volcano in FSM heaven

Re: Alliance war system

TacticalCommander wrote:A good theory

geisha wrote:After the 4 weeks, the victorious alliance is determined based on total damage done and on the total defence power remaining. The score system needs to be well conceived to make sure it is fair and can not be exploited. Since not all alliances have the same amount of resources to destroy, it would be unfair to base it only on total damage done. This is why I think it should also count in the defence an alliance is maintaining during the war. This makes sense because not removing the defences is clearly a failure of the other alliance.


but unfortunately, people will simply bypass that defense one where on the last remaining days of the war, PPT as much as they can 4 -8 days depending on what day war was declared, and build a massive defense to make it look like they won the war.


Not if it counts the defence you have actually been maintaining during the whole war and not only the defence you build at the end of the war. Let's say for every 1 billion defence you maintain for every hour, you get 1 victory point.


TacticalCommander wrote:
"An alliance war lasts 4 weeks, during that period, nobody can join or leave the involved alliances and the alliances can not disband either." Giesha

I would also like to know your rational reasoning behind this, simply because I disaggree and would like to know where your coming from before I debate it.


TC


Because otherwise you could end an alliance war by disbanding your alliance and reforming it again or you could take advantage of leaving your alliance just so you are no longer set to war with the other alliance but still keep massing them.
geisha
touched by his noodly appendage

Image

Image
User avatar
geisha
Forum Addict
Posts: 2810
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:28 pm
Race: Pastafarian
ID: 65545
Location: The beer volcano in FSM heaven

Re: Alliance war system

Oh and the scoring system needs to be very intelligent. You should get victory points for all the different types of attacks and damage done. I guess the balancing would be quite tricky.
geisha
touched by his noodly appendage

Image

Image
RepliMagni
Forum Addict
Posts: 4158
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 9:29 am
Alliance: Loner :P
Race: NanoTiMaster
ID: 1908448

Re: Alliance war system

Sorry if you've covered this, I only scanned through quickly - but the trouble comes when a large alliance with a lot to lose declares war on a smaller alliance.....

For example in the TO/FUALL war....within 4 weeks I'm sure we did more damage to every alliance we were fighting (except maybe Omega) than we received....so would that make us the winners?

It would need to somehow be linked in to army sizes and number of alliance members to take into consideration the varying alliance sizes....

just a thought ;)

Btw: I'd support something like this....I thought this was one of the common suggestions...but that jason just never gets around to :P
Image
User avatar
Angel_F1re
Forum Irregular
Posts: 469
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2005 10:45 am
Race: Ancient
ID: 8226
Location: The Ascended Plain

Re: Alliance war system

TacticalCommander wrote:Ok...the first thing I would suggest is instead of total damage and defense power
a combination of ratios between
Units killed/Units loss
Naq stolen/Naq loss
UU raided/UU loss
Weapon value Sabbed/Weapon value loss
Planets stolen/Planets loss (or maybe a naq value of the planet)

Whoever is killing more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
Whoever is stealing more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
Whoever is raiding more, and losing less will have a higher number, and therefor be winning.
etc

Those 5 numbers are added together to get a score.

By factoring in naq stolen, uu raided, and since your spies will be ac'd (leaving you open to sabbing)if you don't have a defense, this will encourage people to build defenses in war.


I just need is a simple way to balance it out proportionally between big and small players as big players have more to lose, and small players have more take, if its even needed.


Its covered there Magni.
Saved you some scanning.
=]
Image
User avatar
repli**cator
Forum Intermediate
Posts: 848
Joined: Thu May 18, 2006 3:39 pm
Alliance: SOLO
Race: RepliTiMaster
ID: 65108
Alternate name(s): makanko
~mak~
Location: Belgium

Re: Alliance war system

looks great to me..

just make it so that victory points are awarded and the one with most points wins it.

of course on what those points should be based will be the difficult task here.

but this implemented would change much indeed i like it
POWER to the repli/nanoti !
Role Playing
"Be sure brain is engaged before putting mouth in gear"
grimgor
Forum Irregular
Posts: 280
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:30 am
Race: System Lord
ID: 28599

Re: Alliance war system

sound good but

the 1st week you should not get any points form defence

cause an allaince A could mass allaince B then go on PPT for 8 days
Vegas
Forum Grunt
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2007 3:02 pm
Race: Ancient/Indu
ID: 99502
Location: East Coast, US

Re: Alliance war system

I completely agree, great idea. :D
purga
Forum Intermediate
Posts: 773
Joined: Tue May 22, 2007 10:53 am
Race: System Lord
ID: 76793
Location: Slovenia

Re: Alliance war system

good idea
Image

Watch out for Twitchy(id=79058) the backstaber
User avatar
TacticalCommander
Forum Regular
Posts: 631
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:51 am
Race: Saige
ID: 8742
Location: somewhere.....elsewhere....anywhere

Re: Alliance war system

geisha wrote:
Because otherwise you could end an alliance war by disbanding your alliance and reforming it again or you could take advantage of leaving your alliance just so you are no longer set to war with the other alliance but still keep massing them.


Right. But whats the point in making them not leave for the 4 weeks.

Meaning after the 4 weeks of fighting, they could choose to disband the alliance ingame, then just start the fighting again. They will still have the communicational ability through forums and instant messaging to allow them coordinate attacks and not have to worry. There by negating the supposed 2 weeks of peace.

I say people should still be allowed to leave, but they have to do it by themselves, the alliance can't disband.


Also, since these, What we calling Victory Points seems to be the term going around that determines who has more,

Perhaps when a war is over, you can with the points you earned, be exchanged on the market for some reward, maybe x points can get an extra PPT, naq, or even an MT.

Purely an individual basis, that way, this encourages wars, provides a reward for those who stay and fight the 4 weeks. If a person leaves during the war, that person and the alliance loses whatever victory points they earned.

Only once the war is over, you can't spend them while in war.

TC
GLORY TO THE GOD ALMIGHTY!
I am not being aggressive, I am being dominant.
Image
Image
User avatar
Forum
Site Admin
Posts: 2844
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 1:52 pm

Honours and Awards

Re: Alliance war system

i will be updating the alliance war system in the upcoming weeks.
i will not get a chance to look into details for at least another week...but...it will very soon end up in 'upcoming enhancements'.

until i can pay attention to it though- not going to put it there officially...

so for now this is as good a place as any to get ideas expressed on what you'd like to see :)

cheers
admin jason.
Don't make me use this!!!
User avatar
*zesh*
Forum Expert
Posts: 1189
Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:45 pm

Re: Alliance war system

this still isnt the problem

wars need to be winnable

the only way to do this is people cannot play the 0 stat game and do loads of damage

if you have 1t strike you should have 500b def

its like going to war against a country and having no border defence, it doesnt work.

That or make strike supers killable with a special unit or soemthing...
BORED :(
papa says:
bebs
papa says:
man that guy makes me miss mukasa

TLE - This is my family

Image
Image

FOR THE LULZ
SVaRuN
Forum Elder
Posts: 2443
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 3:47 pm
Alliance: The Legion
Race: Roman
Location: The Palatine(Hill)

Re: Alliance war system

total damage meter needs to be diffrent then...


I would go with = personal damage meter which is upgraded (so the planet damages and MS damages are added) so these individual logs all get summed up into one alliance meter for the duration of war...

If that total damage meter then it should be good...






Blue
Image
Quae caret ora cruore nostro?
Post Reply

Return to “Game Suggestions”