The Great Purgatory Debate

[Duderanch]

I think you'll find it was main players asking for the time delay before entering purg to prevent hit and run tactics. Just Sayin'.

[Duderanch]

I think you'll find it was main players asking for the time delay before entering purg to prevent hit and run tactics. Just Sayin'.

[Juliette]

I think you'll find it was main players asking for the time delay before entering purg to prevent hit and run tactics. Just Sayin'.

Ah, but Sylus' last post is about the delay before leaving Pergatory, if I read that right?

[BenjaminMS]

I think you'll find it was main players asking for the time delay before entering purg to prevent hit and run tactics. Just Sayin'.

Ah, but Sylus' last post is about the delay before leaving Pergatory, if I read that right?

@Duderanch: Indeed, that's true Still the other entrance requirements make it quite difficult already to 'just enter' Purgatory.
@Juliette: Indeed, that was the point.

[Sylus]

I lack the ability to critically think?

I never said anything of the sort in reference to you. My post is obviously a direct reply to Arkenius.

ROFLMAO? OK, this gets laughable. So just because Arkenius used something that has been there since about the introduction of Purgatory, you want to close that route down since Ark invested time and resources to use that 'quick leave'-route?

No. I want the 'quick-leave' route gone because it has been systematically abused for years.

How about you look at this update

Evidence:

https://talk.gatewa.rs/viewtopic.php?f=160&t=167492
https://talk.gatewa.rs/viewtopic.php?f=158&t=173640

[on moving from purgatory to norm] Needs 48 hours of no attacking, ppt or vacation, to LEAVE (used to be just to get there...now it is also to leave). The curtain between realms of existence requires a clean soul!

Yep. Read that. Ok. So. Already there's a 48 hour delay. It's in the game. This would be the equivalent of there being a way of killing off your army to automatically jump into purgatory from norm. Meaning someone could effectively hit anyone in norm, snipe planets, then kill off their units to quickly escape. How would that be any different? This is a two way street Ben.

Now, in light of an existing delay:

It has always been there, and it's not a bug - just a feature that you either can ignore and then walk into, or if you want to do what Ark did, use.

Explain how completely bypassing the already introduced update is not a bug? If the game stipulates you must wait 48 hours to move between realms, how is it you're saying the raid exploit doesn't contradict this and therefore isn't a bug?

Then we have this.

So effectively you want a realm where you don't want to be able to get hurt without retaliation and where getting in is already causing severe tactical problems? Get real kid

Can someone tell me in what universe you believe keeping someone in the realm you are in after they've attacked you means "without retaliation". Ben, "without retaliation" is exactly what you're arguing for; you are making a case for the same "hit and run" tactics that were so condemned by norm.
For some reason you're completely at peace with a double standard. In fact you're vehemently defending it... odd choice.

Purgatory already has a LOT of protection - astonishingly much so to prevent 'top players' in Purg from getting effectively hit actually. Way more then Main will ever give. If you want to have an own playground where noone 'evil' disturbs you and you can play an 'King of the Hill', create your own damn game. Till that time, you'll have to do with the current system - asking for more is just ludicrious.

You have yet to suggest an idea that benifits more than just the few. You want change and updates, then stop catering to a select few and look past your personal agenda. Yes I hate perhaps. I see it as some where for people to hide. You keep asking for more protection. Stop. When your ready to discuss a real update, then ill take what you have seriously.

This is so dense, especially in light of everything proposed in this thread.

Explain to me how you believe what is being proposed protects "Top Players"? Point out, with facts, using game mechanics, how what we've proposed benefits only "Top players" and not the purgatory players in general.

We've put in place an extended AT system that allows defenders greater control over war, and further if an account receives aggression against them, they're provided an opportunity to retaliate (but only if they want to).

We are now proposing someone doesn't just come along, empty turns onto you, then flee the realm. How is this only for "top players"!?
It's retarded that you're both even defending the hit and run tactic. If you're both so completely cool with it, propose to norm removing the realm shift delay to purgatory, and see what sort of responses you get from norm. Please by all means do so.

We are seeking a balanced method of opening up the restrictions that exist in Purgatory, restrictions that obviously protect accounts. How many times do we have to say this, restrictions protect accounts. We don't want this. You don't want this.

We are for more fluid gameplay, one that encourages people to hit back. Everything we've proposed does this. You two are arguing against things you actually have said you want in previous purgatory threads: the removal of monopoly accounts in purgatory. But when we propose it, you fight it. Is it solely because we're putting it forward. If a norm player came along and said what we're saying, would you have disagreed or would you all have just patted yourselves on the back for solving the problem.

I don't get you guys. To be so completely biased that you can't see what we're arguing for, and how it applies to the greater game mechanic. Do you honestly believe, that someone can play this game for +5 years seeking a way to sit in isolation!? If I wanted a single player game, I would go play one!

I am happy Tetris at least admitted he is predisposed against purgatory. Care to do the same BenjaminMS?

[Kikaz]

After recently visiting Purgatory for the first time.

I fully support Sylus.

[DaDigi]

Hi guys. Let's try to keep this on topic and not wander too much.

Thanks!

[Arkenius]

Ok so your reason for this to be implemented is that you, as a victim, should have the oportunity to retaliate. Then let me tell you this, as an example:

If I come there, and mass you, I will simply sell everything and untrain. What kind of retaliation will ever get? I will wait 48 hours and move out.

So therefore... the joke's on you again.

[Guild]

Ok so your reason for this to be implemented is that you, as a victim, should have the oportunity to retaliate. Then let me tell you this, as an example:

If I come there, and mass you, I will simply sell everything and untrain. What kind of retaliation will ever get? I will wait 48 hours and move out.

So therefore... the joke's on you again.

how do you mass someone on 60 turns .. :S you cant even mass as it is so your point is void from the of tbh...

also the knowledge that you sold yoru weps for like 10% of their buying value would be funny

[Arkenius]

You dont get it Guild...

Sylus will give me the extra 60AT, because obviously he will simply hit me for fun when I get in perg. I will have the 120 AT to mass his ass.

Also in perg, naq isnt a problem... you can farm 80tril per day...

And I will also simply sell everything just to piss him off... Because he cant retaliate.

And even with lets say a 48 hours wait time... When I get bored I can simply wait and get moved to normal.
So you see? With or without this update, If I really want to put my boot on his head, I can do it, +/- 2days wait...

Therefore such update is useless.

[Kikaz]

You dont get it Guild...

Sylus will give me the extra 60AT, because obviously he will simply hit me for fun when I get in perg. I will have the 120 AT to mass his ass.

Also in perg, naq isnt a problem... you can farm 80tril per day...

And I will also simply sell everything just to piss him off... Because he cant retaliate.

And even with lets say a 48 hours wait time... When I get bored I can simply wait and get moved to normal.
So you see? With or without this update, If I really want to put my boot on his head, I can do it, +/- 2days wait...

Therefore such update is useless.

No its not pointless, someone steals a planet and flees to main, you can't take it back.

There was a 2 day wait implemented in main to prevent this.

It's only fair to have it vice versa..

[Arkenius]

You cannot take a decent planet from perg and go to main... did u see the defences on those duals these guys have or even normal ones?... even with 8 hits per day it takes weeks... Because of the limitation of AT in perg, decent planets that obviously have defences, cannot be taken so easily... even if you are inactive for 2-3 days, on 4th day you come on and eitehr merlin it or rebuild defences.

[Kikaz]

Some people have larger fleets then others.

[Juliette]

You cannot take a decent planet from perg and go to main... did u see the defences on those duals these guys have or even normal ones?... even with 8 hits per day it takes weeks... Because of the limitation of AT in perg, decent planets that obviously have defences, cannot be taken so easily... even if you are inactive for 2-3 days, on 4th day you come on and eitehr merlin it or rebuild defences.

Someone with an actual fleet can take their planets just as easily as they can take planets from normal.

Also, let us get something straight. There is no 'going to Main'. Both Pergatory and Normal are part of Main. Using the wrong terms is wrong.

Some people have larger fleets then others.

*grin* Precisely.

[Arkenius]

well I know for a fact that its very hard and i will give you a solid example too. Last year when I was in perg, I had some 160k UP planet or whatever, it had 4tril def on it. Even western warrior if all his mighty fleet took 3 days to actualy destroy those platforms... and he was hitting for 1tril if memory serves... so even with that huge power it takes time... so its not like normal where u spam and eventualy take it. So it's not like u can hit and run. And if you have a good planet and someone is attacking it for days and eventualy steals it... then it's your damn fault. The problem we are talking here is about ppl who mass or steal planets fast and then run. If it actualy takes days, then it's a whole diferent story.


So yeah, for normal... a 48hr wait time is perfect. But for pergatory, is kinda out of place... in my opinion.