here comes..... 22 :)

[Neimenljivi]

Hmm..If covert and AC stay as 2 separate ranks then replicators are gonna have a significant advantage over others. I also think that it'd even things out if goa'ulds could bank for free - after all resources are what they're good at, right?
That's because every other race has bigger stat bonus than goa'ulds have their income bonus (replicators, again, having the biggest advantage as their bonus influences 2 ranks) so they can a lot easier get some stats up and goa'ulds can't really get much closer, stat-wise, with only 15% bonus on income if banking costs the same.
Replicators also don't need to bank as much as other races have to (due to their C & AC levels being 10%? cheaper) so basically they can save up to 20% naq for each C & AC level..

Also a question - if you send your AMS to destroy someone and opponent is Asguard and you hit hologram - do you still lose your units and opponent doesn't? I think it might be a nice, gambling twist concerning AMS. However I don't think you should lose every AMS you have, maybe 30-60% of them, depending on how the wind blows?

~Jack

[jabujabu]

Hmm..If covert and AC stay as 2 separate ranks then replicators are gonna have a significant advantage over others. I also think that it'd even things out if goa'ulds could bank for free - after all resources are what they're good at, right?
That's because every other race has bigger stat bonus than goa'ulds have their income bonus (replicators, again, having the biggest advantage as their bonus influences 2 ranks) so they can a lot easier get some stats up and goa'ulds can't really get much closer, stat-wise, with only 15% bonus on income if banking costs the same.
Replicators also don't need to bank as much as other races have to (due to their C & AC levels being 10%? cheaper) so basically they can save up to 20% naq for each C & AC level..

Also a question - if you send your AMS to destroy someone and opponent is Asguard and you hit hologram - do you still lose your units and opponent doesn't? I think it might be a nice, gambling twist concerning AMS. However I don't think you should lose every AMS you have, maybe 30-60% of them, depending on how the wind blows?

~Jack

yeah races are definitely bugged
i'm gonna play defense race so i don't waste 10 percent banking...

also, i take it that AMS are one-time nukes and not permanent things?

and it's clear that this era is gonna be very screwed up with AMS exploding on every top account...it's gonna be like a bank era with whoever has the most bank naq wins

also i didn't read carefully, but are mercs destroyable?

and that incentive of giving SS to everyone active on the 30th day, what does active mean?

[Forum]

ok - update (also updated on train page and updates webpage) regards anti-matter specialists (AMS)
they do not target defense supers. and for clarification: they are one time deployments. once they do their thing, they are no longer in our plane of existence as they also have no atoms. this is a nice way to say they die attacking the enemy.

clarificatino on attack and AMS:
the goa'uld/alien hologram does NOT set them off (not enough real matter in the hologram to do so), nor does the defender use their AMS on a tauri/human 'quick strike' that avoids enemy retaliation.

update on cost of cov/AC levels, and weaposn:
cost is same for all races. its the effect of the levels and arms that has the bonus, in this era.

'bugged races' ???
come on - if the goauld are so weak, how come they had 8 or so top 10 finishers each era with a similar setup (at 20% income bonus) -
maybe people just hate banking fees as some type of innate human (and alien and AI) genetic trait??
surely that 5% bank fee cannot be the issue...should i just make bank fee zero for all races - would that make ppl happier?

bank era??
I fail to see how this is a 'bank era' .... that makes little sense to me...can someone spell it out? how does a bigger bank win the era?

[Neimenljivi]

and - if the goauld are so weak, how come they had 8 or so top 10 finishers each era with a similar setup (at 20% income bonus) -surely that 5% bank fee cannot be the issue...should i just make bank fee zero for all races - would that make ppl happier? although i still fail to see how this is a 'bank era' .... that makes little sense to me...

That's because most of the players are Goa'ulds. Ever since replicators got a bonus on 2 ranked stats, they are in a significantly bigger advantage than all other races though and many players switched to replicators.
5% of naq banked can mean a lot in big banks, and as I explained above, replicators would now get instead of 10% discount on spy & AC levels - 20% due to them not needing to store as much naq to buy spy & AC levels as others do so the bank wouldn't take as much naq from them as it would from others (due to replicators having cheaper levels they don't need to store that much naq in bank to buy bigger level thus bank takes less naq away thus they save up a lot more). [hm hope that makes sense lol, I really need to get some sleep]

I'm not saying this is a bank era, but Goa'ulds are (were?) known as the race whose sole purpose is to get as many worshipers and resources, which is why they have income bonus and had no banking fee at beginning, right? So I don't see a reason why this changed. If anything by all the changes races were made more imbalanced - ie Tauri 35% bonus on strike (instead of 25%? originally), Replicators having 25% bonus (stayed same I think), but now they have it on 2 rankable stats instead of 1 which basically gets them 50% bonus, Asgards having 30% bonus instead of 25%? originally, Goa'ulds having 15% bonus on income instead of 20% originally with no banking fee. So all other races got their bonuses increased, especially replicators, while goa'ulds had theirs decreased. I might be wrong on percentage they originally had, as my memory is crap, but I do believe it was 25% for all when I first registered..

~Jack

[Forum]

repost with clearer divisions:
main points are:
reps get no cost break in levels (nor others in weapons) as the break is in the increased effectiveness of the levels/arms.

new: bank fee zero for all races.
race bonuses: goauld 20%income ; asgard 30% def; tauri 35% attack; repli 20% AC and 20% cov
everyone has +1 race change, too.

anti-matter specialists (AMS) update
they do not target defense supers. and for clarification: they are one time deployments. once they do their thing, they are no longer in our plane of existence as they also have no atoms. this is a nice way to say they die attacking the enemy.

clarification on attack and AMS:
the goa'uld/alien hologram does NOT set them off (not enough real matter in the hologram to do so), nor does the defender use their AMS on a tauri/human 'quick strike' that avoids enemy retaliation.

update on cost of cov/AC levels, and weapons
cost is same for all races. its the effect of the levels and arms that has the bonus, in this era.

'bugged races' ???
come on - if the goauld are so weak, how come they had 8 or so top 10 finishers each era with a similar setup (at 20% income bonus) -
maybe people just hate banking fees as some type of innate human (and alien and AI) genetic trait??
surely that 5% bank fee cannot be the issue...should i just make bank fee zero for all races - would that make ppl happier?

and - if the goauld are so weak, how come they had 8 or so top 10 finishers each era with a similar setup (at 20% income bonus) -surely that 5% bank fee cannot be the issue...should i just make bank fee zero for all races - would that make ppl happier? although i still fail to see how this is a 'bank era' .... that makes little sense to me...

That's because most of the players are Goa'ulds. Ever since replicators got a bonus on 2 ranked stats, they are in a significantly bigger advantage than all other races though and many players switched to replicators.
5% of naq banked can mean a lot in big banks, and as I explained above, replicators would now get instead of 10% discount on spy & AC levels - 20% due to them not needing to store as much naq to buy spy & AC levels as others do so the bank wouldn't take as much naq from them as it would from others (due to replicators having cheaper levels they don't need to store that much naq in bank to buy bigger level thus bank takes less naq away thus they save up a lot more). [hm hope that makes sense lol, I really need to get some sleep]

I'm not saying this is a bank era, but Goa'ulds are (were?) known as the race whose sole purpose is to get as many worshipers and resources, which is why they have income bonus and had no banking fee at beginning, right? So I don't see a reason why this changed. If anything by all the changes races were made more imbalanced - ie Tauri 35% bonus on strike (instead of 25%? originally), Replicators having 25% bonus (stayed same I think), but now they have it on 2 rankable stats instead of 1 which basically gets them 50% bonus, Asgards having 30% bonus instead of 25%? originally, Goa'ulds having 15% bonus on income instead of 20% originally with no banking fee. So all other races got their bonuses increased, especially replicators, while goa'ulds had theirs decreased. I might be wrong on percentage they originally had, as my memory is crap, but I do believe it was 25% for all when I first registered..

~Jack

No banking fees would make buying spy levels and AC levels for replicators a bit more expensive in relation with other races now (ie they'd save 'only' 10% for AC level and 10% for covert level instead of 19% they'd save before), but that wouldn't change the fact that replicators still have advantage in 2 stats and the bonuses every other race gets increase, the bonuses goa'ulds get decrease.

To summarize - yes, having no banking fees (for all races) would balance things out a bit (it would basically hurt only replicators who have far too many bonuses currently as they'd save 10% instead of 19% for each spy level they buy, in relation to other races), but the races are still imbalanced.

~Jack

-last quote was a post that got out of order...so now its here...the free bank for all and return of gualud to 20% income bonus should weaken them a bit from free bank + 20% ... lets see how it goes. if next era 8/10 are guauld, i'm mkaing all gualud 3 feet tall...see how that plays

[Neimenljivi]

-last quote was a post that got out of order...so now its here...the free bank for all and return of gualud to 20% income bonus should weaken them a bit from free bank + 20% ... lets see how it goes. if next era 8/10 are guauld, i'm mkaing all gualud 3 feet tall...see how that plays

But yeah, thanks, I think that should even things out more or less

~Jack

[S1eepy]

bank era??
I fail to see how this is a 'bank era' .... that makes little sense to me...can someone spell it out? how does a bigger bank win the era?

This is being seen as a "bank era" because it will be too dangerous to invest your naq in any stats.. when AMSs are around.. so people will hoard naq and biggest bank should win.


Its not true.. but thats the reasoning behind it.
What infact will happen.. is defences will rise quickly on all actives. People will invest in defense to stop the threat of AMSs, and if defense is immune to the effects.. people can hide their units as defenders, and untrain them when needed. At which point I will mass there def units to dust and laugh lots.

--

come on - if the goauld are so weak, how come they had 8 or so top 10 finishers each era with a similar setup

To answer your question Admin, goa'uld do well because the % bonus to income affects many useful things, like; bank size, naq gained from SS's etc. They help.. but they are more like creature comforts.. compared to the other races.. Gould bonus is not as good for "winning the wave". But so many of the good players like their creature comforts that they stick with goa'uld.. and they inevitably do well.. due to their skill, not their race.

Replicators x% bonus to covert means that at endgame, any other race needs x% bigger army to combat it. Unless they can get an extra covert level.. which at that stage costs an arm and a leg. (but costs less for the replicator to match) The bonus applies to 2 ranked stats.. and if you can hold 2rank 1's It makes the rest a whole lot easier.
Techs aren't reliable, because its fairly easy to match some1s techs.

Asgard bonus to defense is useful as a bonus, but not as useful as replicators, because at endgame, it is only 1 ranked stat.
Asgard have a risky free bank (store naq as def weapons and have 100% sell cost). This is a big advantage for asgard this wave, when the other races will be losing 10% of their stored naq.. which is a large amount over the era.
Asgard also get the MS shield bonus (I cant remember what it is.. because its been a while.. but any advantage for MS is good)

Tauri bonus to strike is usefull.. but again.. one rank.. so combatable endgame by focusing other stats. Tauri never really competed on the same level as the other races. Their bonus is primarily a combat one.. and usualy people who focus on waring find it hard to finish well. (just ask kikaz )
But again, they have the MS bonus which is always fun.

Goa'uld's income bonus is not an endgame advantage. Goa'uld need to use their continual advantage through the era to push ahead, and manage to get far enough ahead to hold off the advantages the other races have. But since everything is now linked to top stats. It is impossible to pull ahead in the same way Goa'uld have done in the past.

This is also why replicators have seen a rise in their usefullness. No-one can stretch an armysize advantage.. because its so much cheaper to catch up than push ahead. So any % bonus to covert, basically increases their Armysize at endgame (because everyone trains their whole army as spies)


So.. that was a whole long winded way of saying.. Goa'uld income bonus, is no longer the strength it used to be. I remember when altering the income bonus slightly gave an insane advantage to Goa'uld, because no1 could keep up with their naq spending. But with linked UP stopping any serious armysize advantage... and linked techs stopping them pushing ahead there.. There is no way for Goa'uld to utilize the advantage like they used to.

[Forum]

awesome post. thank you.
some changes will affect a lot of this - like the 20% but no bank advantage for goauld; no cost advantage in repli levels; no cost advantage in MS or weapons; etc...
i do see why goauld did so well, though - and yes the linked stats did tie a proverbial anchor on their foot (the anchor being the rest of the players!) ...

ok - i think the bulk of fine tune is done. I am still thinking of sabotage option on AMS ... but aside from that...

oh -- and AMS does hit normal (untrainable) defenders; just not supers...

bank era??
I fail to see how this is a 'bank era' .... that makes little sense to me...can someone spell it out? how does a bigger bank win the era?

This is being seen as a "bank era" because it will be too dangerous to invest your naq in any stats.. when AMSs are around.. so people will hoard naq and biggest bank should win.


Its not true.. but thats the reasoning behind it.
What infact will happen.. is defences will rise quickly on all actives. People will invest in defense to stop the threat of AMSs, and if defense is immune to the effects.. people can hide their units as defenders, and untrain them when needed. At which point I will mass there def units to dust and laugh lots.
....<more>

[S1eepy]

oh -- and AMS does hit normal (untrainable) defenders; just not supers...

That a recent addition?

Ok, fine tuning almost done.. Can I just try again with a few things.

1. Take away realm alert. Game was better without it

2. Stop the automatic growth of techs.
Last wave nobody built techs. They just grew on their own.. and turned from a great tactical part of the game, to a unused part. Slowing their growth will probably work as well, but I cant see the advantage of having the natural growth there. (but keep them linked)

3. Make covert and anticovert one ranked stat again. But increase the replicators bonus by 5-10% to compensate them. One ranked stat is much easier to combat, even if the advantage is a big one.

4. Put back in the total UP thing, where we can see how many daily incomers we get. (and thereby work out what the top UP is at the moment)

Other than that, wave looks done.. should be an interesting one.. hard to predict. Just the way it should be. Good work

[HippyFool]

oh -- and AMS does hit normal (untrainable) defenders; just not supers...

That a recent addition?

Ok, fine tuning almost done.. Can I just try again with a few things.

1. Take away realm alert. Game was better without it

2. Stop the automatic growth of techs.
Last wave nobody built techs. They just grew on their own.. and turned from a great tactical part of the game, to a unused part. Slowing their growth will probably work as well, but I cant see the advantage of having the natural growth there. (but keep them linked)

3. Make covert and anticovert one ranked stat again. But increase the replicators bonus by 5-10% to compensate them. One ranked stat is much easier to combat, even if the advantage is a big one.

4. Put back in the total UP thing, where we can see how many daily incomers we get. (and thereby work out what the top UP is at the moment)

Other than that, wave looks done.. should be an interesting one.. hard to predict. Just the way it should be. Good work

Everything from this post and your last post I agree on completely. Only thing is that I dont really mind that replis have 2 ranked stats....might be ok to leave it this wave and see how it goes...we do have the option to be repli if we think they have such a big advantage

Absolute BIGGEST thing is get rid of realm alert....IT IS HORRIBLE!!!

[S1eepy]

I've already gone repli, but I still dont think repli's should have 2 ranked stats


admin - in case you missed it
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=161293

[alucard110]

oh -- and AMS does hit normal (untrainable) defenders; just not supers...

That a recent addition?

Ok, fine tuning almost done.. Can I just try again with a few things.

1. Take away realm alert. Game was better without it

2. Stop the automatic growth of techs.
Last wave nobody built techs. They just grew on their own.. and turned from a great tactical part of the game, to a unused part. Slowing their growth will probably work as well, but I cant see the advantage of having the natural growth there. (but keep them linked)

3. Make covert and anticovert one ranked stat again. But increase the replicators bonus by 5-10% to compensate them. One ranked stat is much easier to combat, even if the advantage is a big one.

4. Put back in the total UP thing, where we can see how many daily incomers we get. (and thereby work out what the top UP is at the moment)

Other than that, wave looks done.. should be an interesting one.. hard to predict. Just the way it should be. Good work

Everything from this post and your last post I agree on completely. Only thing is that I dont really mind that replis have 2 ranked stats....might be ok to leave it this wave and see how it goes...we do have the option to be repli if we think they have such a big advantage

Absolute BIGGEST thing is get rid of realm alert....IT IS HORRIBLE!!!

Thirded... I agree with everything there! they would all be great changes!

I'd ESPECIALLY like to see this:

2. Stop the automatic growth of techs.
Last wave nobody built techs. They just grew on their own.. and turned from a great tactical part of the game, to a unused part. Slowing their growth will probably work as well, but I cant see the advantage of having the natural growth there. (but keep them linked)

And S1eepy's point No.4 is also good, i can't see the harm in having that back!

[jabujabu]

I've already gone repli, but I still dont think repli's should have 2 ranked stats


admin - in case you missed it
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=161293

i definitely agree with this,
having the top army last era, but still getting owned by the handfuls of replicators around...
devias beat me to the finish and he had just a tad over 6 mil army (i had 9 mil army)
and that was because his replicator bonus (not to mention other factors...but that was the big one)

from what i see here :
replicator has 2 boosts

gouald sucks because they only have a punitive income boost and no free banking (yes...the past few eras everyone had free banking, but this is SGW style...so it should be different)

and keep crit
otherwise AMSing / massing / sabbing in small amounts could become deadly

[Forum]

1 and 2 are done. (2 was already done). actually - i am undoing 1.. with AMS lets see one more era as a plus, though, i now have realm alert a '0/1' variable to use or not... just one tiny change and POOF its there, POOF its gone, POOF ... you get teh idea
3 will leave as is. as it stands they get 20+20 and if i had it as just one stat, i'd give 40... 6 of one, half dozen of the other
4 maybe. i'll make sure i'm done first though --example: the UP training uu and miners...thats new too for this era.

oh -- and AMS does hit normal (untrainable) defenders; just not supers...

That a recent addition?

Ok, fine tuning almost done.. Can I just try again with a few things.

1. Take away realm alert. Game was better without it

2. Stop the automatic growth of techs.
Last wave nobody built techs. They just grew on their own.. and turned from a great tactical part of the game, to a unused part. Slowing their growth will probably work as well, but I cant see the advantage of having the natural growth there. (but keep them linked)

3. Make covert and anticovert one ranked stat again. But increase the replicators bonus by 5-10% to compensate them. One ranked stat is much easier to combat, even if the advantage is a big one.

4. Put back in the total UP thing, where we can see how many daily incomers we get. (and thereby work out what the top UP is at the moment)

Other than that, wave looks done.. should be an interesting one.. hard to predict. Just the way it should be. Good work

Everything from this post and your last post I agree on completely. Only thing is that I dont really mind that replis have 2 ranked stats....might be ok to leave it this wave and see how it goes...we do have the option to be repli if we think they have such a big advantage

Absolute BIGGEST thing is get rid of realm alert....IT IS HORRIBLE!!!

[HippyFool]

Thanks for getting rid of realm alert

Please turn your attention to this important problem, however...

viewtopic.php?f=96&t=161295

Big bug