Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

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Juliette
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Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

In light of our measures against feeding, we are re-balancing the previous update (destruction of resources at a certain threshold), and introducing a countermeasure we think is both more fair and less complicated.

The previous update will be reduced to 50% destroyed: threshold remains the same (2x carrying capacity), but we overestimated the corruption by the people in your realm, apparently they only steal 50% of what was stolen éxtra on top of it. (So: [spoiler]

Code: Select all

Carrying capacity: 100M
Threshold: 200M
15AT attack above threshold: 100M stolen *and* 50M destroyed. (as opposed to current 100M stolen and 100M destroyed.
[/spoiler]

We are introducing a daily max per player you can steal, of 10 times your current carrying capacity. Only the Naquadah stolen counts, not the Naquadah destroyed by the above measure. The counter resets every day. This functions as a feeder limiter.

The science is that with that much energy (Naquadah in hyperspace transport) travelling over the same spacetime path, there is the risk of collapsing spacetime on that location - such catastrophe would prevent you from ever reaching that destination again. Your captains know that you are not a physics expert, and will simply not attack when such Naquadah has been taken.


To illustrate:
    Player A has 100M carrying capacity.
    Player B has 4B Naquadah in the open.
    Player A attacks: 100M N stolen, and another 50M N destroyed, player B has 3.850B N left.
    Player A attacks 9 more times: each hit 100M N is stolen, and another 50M N destroyed. Player B has 2.500B N left.
    Player A cannot attack player B again until the next day.
    (However: Player B can still be attacked by Player C, D, ..
    Player A can still attack player C, D, ..)


This update will be implemented in the coming days; BEFORE the next Market Reset. Consider this due warning. :D
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Z E R O
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Could this have the potential of harming legitimate farmers who have stumbled upon a nice and juicy naq hit?

It's been a couple months, but I found a hit of 2.3b back when my carrying capacity was a mere 50b. I was able to steal it all.. and I thought it well deserving having me followed the naq and waited for for that PPT to drop. I currently have a carrying capacity of 240m, does that mean I can only effectively steal up to 2.4b?

I just don't think it's fair that an anti-feeding measure should harm diligent farmers..
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

yes i agred is to low..maybe 20 or 30 times your current carrying capacity..
i,m lucky because i ascend today... :smt025 :smt060 :sge =D> :smt064
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Juliette
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Spread the wealth, brothers. :D

The 'harming of diligent farmers' would primarily be caused by the high rate of Naquadah destruction. The change as it is will allow more people to profit from the same 'PPT miss', and restrict feeding to a certain standard, ergo it makes it more fair for diligent farmers, in my observation.
Basing an entire balance on singular occurrences seems counter-intuitive; incidental accidents (PPT misses) vs. attempted active system 'tricking' (feeding). Feeding takes priority; everyone can still farm (very profitably so, as 10x your carrying capacity is more than most people farm in a day from a single farm) and if you do come across a great hit, call in your friends, i.e. promotes player interactivity. :D

ps. This is not a discussion on numbers, but I do appreciate your thoughts. If anyone wants to run the numbers on their current farming, I would be interested to read that. :)
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

I strongly disagree,

Farming is already mega-underpowered as it is, several players, including myself, one of the most active farmers on the server, make more naq per day off income than we can farm in a week. Taking away the dream of finding that one good hit, makes farming so much less desirable. When it already is quite so. I agree with the need to stomp out feeding, as I don't support it any more than the next guy. I just wish we could come up with another way to accomplish it...
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Z E R O wrote:I strongly disagree,

Farming is already mega-underpowered as it is. (several players, including myself one of the most active farmers on the server) make more naq per day than we can farm in a week. Taking away the dream of finding that one good hit, makes farming so much less desirable. When it already is quite so. I agree with the need to stomp out feeding, as I don't support it any more than the next guy. I just wish we could come up with another way to accomplish it...

agree with ZERO here...is war game with farming on base...so if farming will become nonprofitable then we just will grow ourself and nobody will do nothing...what is the point to grow only on your income ??
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

™LoT wrote:
Z E R O wrote:I strongly disagree,

Farming is already mega-underpowered as it is. (several players, including myself one of the most active farmers on the server) make more naq per day than we can farm in a week. Taking away the dream of finding that one good hit, makes farming so much less desirable. When it already is quite so. I agree with the need to stomp out feeding, as I don't support it any more than the next guy. I just wish we could come up with another way to accomplish it...

agree with ZERO here...is war game with farming on base...so if farming will become nonprofitable then we just will grow ourself and nobody will do nothing...what is the point to grow only on your income ??


I concur.
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

This update 100% hurts farmers and 0% hurts people getting illegally fed.

Example 1 (the law abiding farmer): la di da di da (this is their farming noise)... O . M . G look at all that naq that that guy has out! I am so lucky! Yay finally looking through every page 3 times a day is paying off! Woo, 10b for me! Woo so happy he missed his PPT (etc. etc.)

*let's assume he is a quality farmer and has 250m carrying capacity which is pretty big*

2 hits later.... :shock: ..... :( ..... #-o .... ](*,) .... :smt089 (when he realizes he only got 500m).

Example 2 (the filthy law stomping feed crazy hooligan): Yayyy I am ascending today!

*trains all his UU into MS*... waits for daily turn change... MS now has carrying capacity of 2bil.

Hey mum, dad, brother, sister, dog, second aunt, adopted twin, bird in the corner... can you all make accounts, click your weekly market naq and then log off again? Wow, thanks!

*hits each twice for 4bil per account*

__________

Why not just not have any limits... and punish people that get fed? It is VERY EASY to work out who gets fed and who actually gets lucky.

:smt018
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Your maths is wrong, judging from Jo's post the 250m fleets guy should be able to get up to 2.5b

whereas the 2bil fleets guy is gonna be 20b. Unless i've misinterpreted Juliette's information.. Though somehow this makes what you're saying seem even worse..
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HippyFool
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Ah yeah...10x not 2x .... just makes it worse :)
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

I feel that this update is completely unnecessary with limiting the number of times you can attack a person. With the current system of destroying an enemies naq when you attack already puts a major damper of feeding as it is since they will need to have a lot more naq for it to be effective now.

Also with this new corruption of naq system for attacking. One would have to ask what is the point of even having blitzkreig now. With blitzkreig one can only burn a players naq and kill a couple ground troops. They cant destroy motherships, pastors, spies/anti spies, or weapons with blitzkreig.

Basically with these new updates you have effectively made the normal attack exactly like blitzkreig except with the normal attack they have the capability of destroying motherships and a slightly higher turn cost. So i gotta ask whats the point of even having the blitzkreig option if the normal attack is gonna be exactly like it?
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

xdjoker wrote:I feel that this update is completely unnecessary with limiting the number of times you can attack a person. With the current system of destroying an enemies naq when you attack already puts a major damper of feeding as it is since they will need to have a lot more naq for it to be effective now.

Also with this new corruption of naq system for attacking. One would have to ask what is the point of even having blitzkreig now. With blitzkreig one can only burn a players naq and kill a couple ground troops. They cant destroy motherships, pastors, spies/anti spies, or weapons with blitzkreig.

Basically with these new updates you have effectively made the normal attack exactly like blitzkreig except with the normal attack they have the capability of destroying motherships and a slightly higher turn cost. So i gotta ask whats the point of even having the blitzkreig option if the normal attack is gonna be exactly like it?

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Mathlord wrote:
doc holliday wrote:just don't come off ppt :smt071 :smt043
See what doc is really saying, is his six shooters tickle...until you die from it :D
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prsko wrote:
SSG EnterTheLion wrote: As anyone who knows me knows, I never build up planets, if I steal a good one, so be it, but I never waste naq on a planet.
So that triple planet u bought was allready built up?
Or am I twisting your words like the rest?
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Glad you finally considered my suggestion from viewtopic.php?p=2498285#p2498285
BMMJ13 wrote:In fact if you really want to limit feeding, you should make it so there's like a maximum amount of naq you can steal from a person a day, say 10x of your max carrying capacity. That should be enough that most players can go normally, while still limiting feeding, yet avoiding screwing over those who play normally.


Juliette wrote:No - for now - to a farming cap. The idea is good, and we will continue to evaluate its feasibility and values, but this is not going to happen - not now anyway. :) (Good thought though.)

The 'destruction' only takes place when the attacker has 100+ MS, so 'low MS players' (big majority of players) can just farm like they want. 'Big MS players' can farm as much as they want too, just need to think who you are going to hit. ;) (And need a little more coordination when friends want to help out, if you want the full feed.)


Though I would think others may be correct and my earlier suggestion of 10x may be too low, though I don't agree that this is hurting normal farmers more than feeders and the previous system was very flawed as it took me 5 minutes to think of a way around it should I have wanted to circumvent it.
Mar 18, 14:52 General Zeus Sabotage Repelled 104,724,369 details
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doc holliday
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

I think BMMJ would be a smart man to listen too. Because his name is orange :-D
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Mathlord wrote:
doc holliday wrote:just don't come off ppt :smt071 :smt043
See what doc is really saying, is his six shooters tickle...until you die from it :D
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prsko wrote:
SSG EnterTheLion wrote: As anyone who knows me knows, I never build up planets, if I steal a good one, so be it, but I never waste naq on a planet.
So that triple planet u bought was allready built up?
Or am I twisting your words like the rest?
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Re: Pre-announcement: Rebalance / Farming

Oh didn't even realize you were suggesting that the previous update, which many considered stupid, is still in the game. Perhaps it would be wise to listen to the many players who are saying it is a bad idea and stick to just one method to control feeding, such as limit of 20-30x carrying capacity a day per person farmed.
Mar 18, 14:52 General Zeus Sabotage Repelled 104,724,369 details
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