Making Undeveloped planets more involved with the game.

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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by ~Tziki~ » Sun Apr 20, 2014 7:53 pm

Clockwork wrote:or you could keep untrained planets exactly how they are now, but remove the ability to untrain spies and assassins just like you can't untrain the super attack / def planet clusters (unless you pay an APP cost to work your ascended mojo and reorder things).
again... just no.

The way covert works current you need a much larger covert to see people who have relatively small amounts of covert power. Forcing you to train a good amount of planets before you can even see DMU to go farming. Forcing players to commit such large amounts of planets to something that cant be untrained is pointless.


Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by Sol » Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:19 pm

~Tziki~ wrote: Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
I'll reiterate a few things I've said earlier, this games core idea is about war and strategy, it's 'slow' for the latter reason - of which you see it this way, but not the first. I build detours sure, things to do other than make war with someone, but eventually you build and farm to prep for war.
The fuzzy point I'm trying to make, and have made, is that accounts can be completely removed from the game, out of the whole idea it's made for. While I'm not straight out advocating untrained planets should be killable or raidable, they should do something more to the account than produce some pitiful income.
I would like some people to get a bit creative though.
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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by Sniperwax » Sun Apr 20, 2014 8:34 pm

Sol wrote:
~Tziki~ wrote: Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
I'll reiterate a few things I've said earlier, this games core idea is about war and strategy, it's 'slow' for the latter reason - of which you see it this way, but not the first. I build detours sure, things to do other than make war with someone, but eventually you build and farm to prep for war.
The fuzzy point I'm trying to make, and have made, is that accounts can be completely removed from the game, out of the whole idea it's made for. While I'm not straight out advocating untrained planets should be killable or raidable, they should do something more to the account than produce some pitiful income.
I would like some people to get a bit creative though.
I would be more than satisfied with a mechanism that allows for lightly trimming down the abandoned accounts. Some of them have amazing expanses. Instead of making untrained planets entirely killable maybe there is a compromise that allows for a small amount of them to be killed that is relative to their expanse ranking?

If left as is then please consider boosting the start of CER tapering higher than 5b at some point. It really is kind of odd that the people that enjoy the ASC server the most get stuck waaaaay below the inactives in expanse. It shouldn't take 4 months of being inactive myself to get within range of the long term inactives or was that designed intentionally?

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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by Sol » Mon Apr 21, 2014 3:05 am

Sniperwax wrote:
Sol wrote:
~Tziki~ wrote: Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
I'll reiterate a few things I've said earlier, this games core idea is about war and strategy, it's 'slow' for the latter reason - of which you see it this way, but not the first. I build detours sure, things to do other than make war with someone, but eventually you build and farm to prep for war.
The fuzzy point I'm trying to make, and have made, is that accounts can be completely removed from the game, out of the whole idea it's made for. While I'm not straight out advocating untrained planets should be killable or raidable, they should do something more to the account than produce some pitiful income.
I would like some people to get a bit creative though.
I would be more than satisfied with a mechanism that allows for lightly trimming down the abandoned accounts. Some of them have amazing expanses. Instead of making untrained planets entirely killable maybe there is a compromise that allows for a small amount of them to be killed that is relative to their expanse ranking?
Why? What would be the point at all?
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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by Sniperwax » Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:33 pm

Sol wrote:
Sniperwax wrote:
Sol wrote:
~Tziki~ wrote: Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
I'll reiterate a few things I've said earlier, this games core idea is about war and strategy, it's 'slow' for the latter reason - of which you see it this way, but not the first. I build detours sure, things to do other than make war with someone, but eventually you build and farm to prep for war.
The fuzzy point I'm trying to make, and have made, is that accounts can be completely removed from the game, out of the whole idea it's made for. While I'm not straight out advocating untrained planets should be killable or raidable, they should do something more to the account than produce some pitiful income.
I would like some people to get a bit creative though.
I would be more than satisfied with a mechanism that allows for lightly trimming down the abandoned accounts. Some of them have amazing expanses. Instead of making untrained planets entirely killable maybe there is a compromise that allows for a small amount of them to be killed that is relative to their expanse ranking?
Why? What would be the point at all?
To keep beings from ascending to an even higher plane of existence? If you haven't logged in for a year or two you should be farmed accordingly. And as a preventative measure also. Should the account magically come back to life one day after years they could CLICK CLICK vaporize the top accounts with ease. I would hope you can see the injustice of that scenario.

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Re: Allow for the destruction of Undeveloped Planets.

Post by ~Tziki~ » Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:04 am

Sniperwax wrote:
Sol wrote:
Sniperwax wrote:
Sol wrote:
~Tziki~ wrote: Long story short this thread is all about forcing the abundance of planets to kill. Ascended is a slower paced server, and as such its not all about massing constantly and destroying planets ALL the time. Such is made obvious by the slower turn refill rate and lack of ability to buy AT's at will. or through a MT. You can build, or dont build. you can choose to mass those that do build or save your AT's for farming, but your suggestion is very much about forcing everyone to play the game in one style... the style that forces them to make losses for no reason.
I'll reiterate a few things I've said earlier, this games core idea is about war and strategy, it's 'slow' for the latter reason - of which you see it this way, but not the first. I build detours sure, things to do other than make war with someone, but eventually you build and farm to prep for war.
The fuzzy point I'm trying to make, and have made, is that accounts can be completely removed from the game, out of the whole idea it's made for. While I'm not straight out advocating untrained planets should be killable or raidable, they should do something more to the account than produce some pitiful income.
I would like some people to get a bit creative though.
I would be more than satisfied with a mechanism that allows for lightly trimming down the abandoned accounts. Some of them have amazing expanses. Instead of making untrained planets entirely killable maybe there is a compromise that allows for a small amount of them to be killed that is relative to their expanse ranking?
Why? What would be the point at all?
To keep beings from ascending to an even higher plane of existence? If you haven't logged in for a year or two you should be farmed accordingly. And as a preventative measure also. Should the account magically come back to life one day after years they could CLICK CLICK vaporize the top accounts with ease. I would hope you can see the injustice of that scenario.
anyone can destroy the top ranked accounts within 10 days of preparation time. Your point is invalid.

And yes whilst it may well be a war game, wars are fought with soldiers, that are supplied by civilians. engaging on unarmed civilians is heavily frowned upon (and illegal by most standards) so it stands to reason untained (civilian) planets/units shouldnt be targetted either.

There is nothing to gain from killing untrained planets other than slowly killing the economy because that little income they generate is no long happening.


if you really want to change anything, just remove the concept of untrained planets and have everything go straight into miners, and you train directly from your miners pool.
That way people who dont build anything atleast provide their enemies with DMU. Which means you have to either build something to protect your account, or accept that if you are too passive and dont want to be massed/mass someone then you will be farmed.
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Re: Making Undeveloped planets more involved with the game.

Post by Sniperwax » Thu May 08, 2014 12:00 am

That would cause rapid inflation sadly. The people that farmed almost daily for a year + might take issue with people catching up in DMU STOLEN in a month or less. Even if you could somehow AT refill every couple days you couldn't farm enough to keep your stats significantly higher than Joe Newbie.

If we can't blow up undevs and we can't steal them and we can't make them miners the ideas dry up on how to deal with them. The CER penalty above 5b+ expanse could be tweaked slightly. Nothing dramatic! Just a teency weency little THANK YOU FOR SUPPORTING ASC SERVER nod to gamers that play the damned contraption faithfully.

Something non-Earth shattering like a .33% reduction to the CER penalty if at least a third of your units are developed. They can be anything even miners you just need a third trained. .50% bonus for at least 2/3 trained. Add the same .5% penalty to accounts with 2/3++ untrained.

So for my 1,697,243,233 CER with 8,393,846,333 planets slashed down to 11.63% growth making 197,400,000 planets a day by having at least 1/3 trained gets me 11.96% thus 203,000,000 planets a day or 2/3 trained is 12.13% thus 205,900,000.

Or I could take the lazy ignorant tool route and sit untrained for months or years because that really shows my support of ASC server so sitting with at least 2/3 untrained drops me to 11.13% growth / 189,000,000 planets a day in this scenario.

The difference may seem trivial but as the expanse gets larger the ASC server supporter is growing slightly faster than the guy who last logged into ASC during Obama's first term. On top of the CER tweak I still think any top 10 expanse account that hasn't logged in for ages should be fair game for some negative CER growth.

Again nothing too dramatic just a balance measure. Like omg omg omg sorry you didn't log in for several years we should have waited for you to come back so we could ask your opinion before we ruined your shot at 60b expanse.

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Re: Making Undeveloped planets more involved with the game.

Post by Unsterblich » Mon May 19, 2014 4:30 am

Clockwork wrote:A large percentage of accounts on ascended sit in a state of 'safeness' with little to nothing built that can be attacked. Usually planets are left as Undeveloped because nothing 'bad' can happen to them, and they don't produce a lot of incomine like Production planets.

I would suggest that a new attack be made available, to directly destroy 'Undeveloped' planets. They don't afterall have any 'defences' built on them :P

The attack could either take form as an expensive (turn wise) normal attack, or maybe something like Lifering on main, where you hurl X number of your own 'Undeveloped' planets at the enemy destroying Y number of their 'Undeveloped' planets.

This would mean the only 'safe' planets would be 'Production' planets, and if people continue to just build 'safe' planets, at least they are producing nice DMU incoming for the rest of the server :P

The aim of this suggestion is to get more people actually 'playing' on the server, not just sitting 'safe' and ignoring it.

Anyway, comments, agreements, arguments against are all welcome.
it would be good to see the players making use of the untrained planets by either train them into income so they become beter farms.
but it would be irrelevant to raid the untrained planets so some will just grow beyond measures and instead of raiding u would be able to destroy it in ratio'd hits.
Juliette mentioned it in on of her posts and the CER will give u the planets u need.
so either become a farm or hand out free ME.
there are 70% of the server that sits with huge amounts of untrained planets and the train up to mass and untrain again
so they loose the minimun.
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