Hope - id 1913240

list of users that, due to poor behaviour, not fulfilling deals, or otherwise, are banned from trading....
DO NOT trade with these people, else you will lose what you give!

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Neimenljivi
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Hope - id 1913240

Scammed me of my graphics work.
He knew the terms of my deal - when somebody hires me I work until the customer is satisfied with the result, and customer gives me feedback on what needs to be changed if he or she wants to (whether it's a case of misunderstanding what exactly the customer wishes, or a case of customer not liking my interpretation - doesn't matter. If the graphic as a whole is not like the customer wishes it to be - I create a completely new design and scrap the old one, but that is something a customer has to tell me), however a payment at the end is obligatory as I don't work for free.
He hired me and after I presented my work didn't reply to me at all until I told him that in case he doesn't pay me I will have no other choice than to report him as a scammer. He said he didn't like the sig and refused to pay me. Of course, had he said what he wanted me to change, I wouldn't have any problems with changing it to his liking. However I expect a payment at the end. He chose not to ask me to change anything - that's fine with me, but like he knew at the beginning of the deal - once he hires me he has to pay me for my work. I get paid for the work I put in the sig, not whether the customer chooses to wear the sig or not.

I would recommend anyone against trading with him and I will try to make sure no other sig maker gets scammed by him, like I got.

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
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harchester
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

shall we just sit on him :)
Even if you hear a bad story about me, Understand that there was a time I was good to those people to, But they won’t tell you that...
Neimenljivi
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

I would have done that myself already, but my account isn't really a fighting one as I only PPT and sell naq for $$, so I can't do much :?
If an old friend would do that for me, I'd be more than delighted :)

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
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2012 Awards awarded to me:
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harchester
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Neimenljivi wrote:I would have done that myself already, but my account isn't really a fighting one as I only PPT and sell naq for $$, so I can't do much :?
If an old friend would do that for me, I'd be more than delighted :)

~N


i got your back hombre...will post logs soon 8)
Even if you hear a bad story about me, Understand that there was a time I was good to those people to, But they won’t tell you that...
Neimenljivi
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Thanks a lot mate, looking forward to seeing them and to see that scammer get what he deserves :)

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
{Banned}
2012 Awards awarded to me:
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lone dragon
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Why dont you let him talk and see what he has to say first.
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

lone dragon wrote:Why dont you let him talk and see what he has to say first.
Read again. They already spoke, the excerpt below being a paraphrasing of said conversation. Conversation starts at underlined element.
Neimenljivi wrote:He hired me and after I presented my work didn't reply to me at all until I told him that in case he doesn't pay me I will have no other choice than to report him as a scammer. He said he didn't like the sig and refused to pay me. Of course, had he said what he wanted me to change, I wouldn't have any problems with changing it to his liking. However I expect a payment at the end. He chose not to ask me to change anything - that's fine with me, but like he knew at the beginning of the deal - once he hires me he has to pay me for my work. I get paid for the work I put in the sig, not whether the customer chooses to wear the sig or not.
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Neimenljivi
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

He saw my style before he ordered me.
He could have simply said - "mate I don't like that sig, can you do another one in a different style without this and this and use that and that" - I would have happily done it.
He hasn't said anything about it for a week or so after I'd send him the sig, until I told him what I intend to do if he doesn't follow up his end of the deal.

Making a custom ordered sig and then not be paid for the work, even though, as I said, he could have told me what to change, means being scammed.

It doesn't matter whether he wears the sig or not - customers pay for my work.

Had he said - change it, and I'd say no - yes then he'd have a reason not to like my work. There are almost always small details that need editing which is why customers give feedback. If they don't, and seeing how they hired me and know how I work, they either pay like they are supposed to, or they scam you like Hope scammed me. That's how things roll. He had the chance to ask me to change stuff and he didn't use it - that's his choice. Nonetheless after being hired I expect to be paid for the work I put into a sig.

Yes like Julietta said - we already spoke, I wouldn't have taken this step, had we not spoken about it and had his intentions not been made clear.

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
{Banned}
2012 Awards awarded to me:
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Arios
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Julietta Putina wrote:
lone dragon wrote:Why dont you let him talk and see what he has to say first.
Read again. They already spoke, the excerpt below being a paraphrasing of said conversation. Conversation starts at underlined element.
Neimenljivi wrote:He hired me and after I presented my work didn't reply to me at all until I told him that in case he doesn't pay me I will have no other choice than to report him as a scammer. He said he didn't like the sig and refused to pay me. Of course, had he said what he wanted me to change, I wouldn't have any problems with changing it to his liking. However I expect a payment at the end. He chose not to ask me to change anything - that's fine with me, but like he knew at the beginning of the deal - once he hires me he has to pay me for my work. I get paid for the work I put in the sig, not whether the customer chooses to wear the sig or not.



Quite, however I believe LD simply wishes to hear Hope voice his own opinion and perspective of this event.

On topic, is it not a scam in itself to force someone to pay for an item they do not want? Albeit you do say in your topic a customer has to pay for a sig you make; once of course they ask you to make something, yet you do not say anything about a price or what price should be paid if your work is deemed 'below standard'. You're not the only sig maker out there and by far no where near the best, so don't act like an extortionate tyrant with imagery that is typically made using mostly copyrighted material made most likely with stolen software.
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Neimenljivi
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Which is why he had an option to make me change the sig into something he wants.
If a sig is deemed "below standard" by a customer, the customer has the right to ask me to completely redo the sig (I work until the customer is satisfied, something that you can read in my terms). That means no additional charge for changes that the customer wants. At the beginning when someone asks me how much it'll cost after I hear the details which they want in a sig I tell them in what price range will the sig be. Anyone can ask me that - Hope didn't, however Hope didn't even hear the price for the sig in question as I didn't tell him "pay me X naq or you'll be a scammer" - I told him to reply to my message or else I'll consider him a scammer. He replied saying he won't pay me. He didn't say anything about wanting me to change something in the sig, which is what he had the right to ask (again, I did direct him to the my sig shop which is where he could read my terms, if he hasn't - that's his fault, not mine).

I don't extort - I want to be paid for the work I put into and since I did not get paid - I got scammed.
Am I the best currently? Seeing how most people seem to choose me, and like you said I'm not the only sig maker out there, I'd say that says all. No one is forced to choose me, however once they do choose me they have to follow my terms.

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
{Banned}
2012 Awards awarded to me:
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

This is obviously some sort of misunderstanding. Hope is not a scammer. He's a decent, honest person.
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Gohan
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Ok. You said you would do this, so it's no real shock. It's simply a large misunderstanding.

You linked me to your sig shop on the forums and i viewed some of your work. Some of it was good. I then linked you to my thread, in which i clearly state that i will pay what i think the work is worth.

My link to the thread -- viewtopic.php?f=142&t=189042

Direct quote #1 - "7. How much do you wish to pay? I'll pay to what i think the work is worth, maximum of 10t."

Since you came to my thread in which i state the terms, this shows that i will pay what the sig is worth. The reason i did not give you anything is very simple and is in the next quote.

Direct quote #2 -"9. Any further information (dates, etc or anything not mentioned above, you can attach any pictures etc you would like used) If you use any pictures from Assassin Creed, please use the assassin from Assassin Creed Revelations, not Altair. If you aren't using AC images, forget about that"

You gave me a sig, main focus, huge picture of Altair...

Anyway. I'm willing to sort this issue out in a simple manner. I will accept your terms and pay you in full to a reasonable amount you ask up front and we will together create a signature that i like. If we come to no agreement, you have the naq for the total project and have lost nothing, if we do come to an agreement on the picture, then it's all fine.

What do you think?
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The Murkar
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Neimenljivi wrote:Am I the best currently? Seeing how most people seem to choose me, and like you said I'm not the only sig maker out there, I'd say that says all.


I think I'll just skip right on past this little jab and move on into the good stuff, shall I?

EDIT: Hmmm...he posted while I was writing my response to this so I'll cut off the rest of my reply here; personally I would be ashamed of myself for demanding money for my work from somebody who did not deem it worthy of the coin.

From the above post...he seems more than reasonable to me and very willing to offer [possibly undue] generosity to clear this up ;)
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Neimenljivi
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Mate by hiring me you abide to my terms, as I'm the one doing the work. Anyway that is beside the point now. I agree to what you are proposing, however I want the naq to be brokered to me upfront. I agree to work until you are satisfied which is what I do with all the numerous customers I have and it is also in my terms. Once this is finished I will ask the mods to delete the thread.
Also like I said - I don't play Assassins Creed, never have, so I have no idea who is who. The assassin I used was supposed to be the right one, according to google, and is just a render which can easily be changed and I would have changed it immediately, had you simply said "Please change the assassin from the sig with assassin from the image you can find here xxxxxxxxxxxxxx for example" and this wouldn't have had to go so far.

Murkar - if I work - I expect to get paid. That's why I don't enter contests, except under unusual circumstances, and such things. That's why somebody has to hire me and by doing that also agree to my terms before I do any work. It is then up to customer to either pay me and not like it or ask me to change certain things or completely redo something until the customer likes it. I am obliged to do that, by my terms of work, and I also happily do it. This doesn't increase the cost of the sig at all. So the customer has every right to keep me working on a graphic until it meets customer's desires, which is what I think is fair, however I also think it's then fair I get paid for the work I put into it. If the customer doesn't want to use that right - well that's not my problem. I think my terms are more than fair for both parties as they ensure the customer gets what s/he wants and I get the naq I think is worth.
So in your worths - if the customer deems it's not worth the coin - s/he can say so and I'll work until it's worth the coin in the eyes of the customer, which is when I also expect to get paid. But the customer is the one that has to say what should I change, if nothing is said about that - then I expect the work is done and expect to get paid.

~N
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Haz wrote:It took a bit of time, but the investigation has now been completed.
S1eepy will be banned for scripting, for the remainder of this era.
Name: S1eepy [ TheCheekyChickens ]
{Banned}
2012 Awards awarded to me:
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Wolfstien
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Re: Hope - id 1913240

Oops, sorry, I didn't mean to enter here but I tripped over an ego as I was backing out. To be honest, you should start looking at graphic design as more of a hobby than a chore. Which is why you feel the need to be paid. I don't know about you, but I put ever bit of effort into the sigs I make, thus being I am happy with whatever the customer chooses. Whether it be they don't want it or simple changes. The fact is, the more you work on your sigs the better you become. Now, why would you try and lock someone into a deal? That's not exactly the way things should work. That in itself is scamming. A customer should ALWAYS have a way out, it doesn't matter what you think. Remember that age old saying, "The customer comes first?" well that comes into play here.

With my thoughts out of the way, I'll just take one giant step and be out the door. Good luck with resolving this.

Wolfstien
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