The 2012 USA Presidential Elections thread

[Legendary Apophis]

I might be rather conservative myself but I don't understand why ID card is such a no no. I mean fraud revealed sometimes by voters themselves, it should be the alarm ring to require an ID card and a list of the people from the city/county to make sure "Bob" isn't voting in every town in the county...thus facing cases where one person =! one vote.

[Psyko]

I might be rather conservative myself but I don't understand why ID card is such a no no. I mean fraud revealed sometimes by voters themselves, it should be the alarm ring to require an ID card and a list of the people from the city/county to make sure "Bob" isn't voting in every town in the county...thus facing cases where one person =! one vote.

The biggest problem with the voter ID laws comes to cost. Many Americans don't have State-issued ID, especially if they do not drive, because of the cost to get one. Even student IDs don't have all of the information the ID laws were requiring. The controversy became worse when they said IDs like Gun Licenses were valid forms of ID, making people hysterical that the "gun-toting Republicans" wouldn't have issues, but the "liberal youth" would be left out.

Added pressure came from the fact that the voter ID laws weren't addressed until 1 month ago, not giving the millions of Americans without valid IDs time to have them issued. When I first got my driver's license, I had it within 10 minutes of having my picture taken. Now, it takes 6 weeks to receive it in the mail (much like a Passport).

Of course voter ID laws were shot down. They didn't address all of the issues and didn't allow for the cost/time for everyone to receive them.

[Legendary Apophis]

How can you, in the US, then prevent issues like the example provided by Juliette of guys voting in each cities of the county, or people who aren't meant to vote (non citizens, tourists etc..) if they aren't asked to show a proof of ID (even if it's just driving licence/gun licence)?
I mean, imagine a woman who is divorced, she can go dressed a way with her former married name and then go with her divorced name, by just changing hairstyle, adding big glasses and some makeup to avoid being recognized by the committee.

Who knows how many votes within the mass are invalid...

[1horseman]

In Milwaukee, and most big(er) cities, all you need to do is list a valid address to vote. Bussing people in and handing out an address and a sample ballot is no big secret. At least many of the people bussed in are rewarded with a pack of Newports.

[Psyko]

How can you, in the US, then prevent issues like the example provided by Juliette of guys voting in each cities of the county, or people who aren't meant to vote (non citizens, tourists etc..) if they aren't asked to show a proof of ID (even if it's just driving licence/gun licence)?
I mean, imagine a woman who is divorced, she can go dressed a way with her former married name and then go with her divorced name, by just changing hairstyle, adding big glasses and some makeup to avoid being recognized by the committee.

Who knows how many votes within the mass are invalid...

Because you have to register to vote with a valid name, address, and social security card. Many states do it differently. In my state I can vote by mail, so they mail my ballot to me and I can either mail it back or drop it in a ballot box at select locations around town. That can create fraud on its own.

There is no perfect system.

[Empy]

How can you, in the US, then prevent issues like the example provided by Juliette of guys voting in each cities of the county, or people who aren't meant to vote (non citizens, tourists etc..) if they aren't asked to show a proof of ID (even if it's just driving licence/gun licence)?
I mean, imagine a woman who is divorced, she can go dressed a way with her former married name and then go with her divorced name, by just changing hairstyle, adding big glasses and some makeup to avoid being recognized by the committee.

Who knows how many votes within the mass are invalid...

Because you have to register to vote with a valid name, address, and social security card. Many states do it differently. In my state I can vote by mail, so they mail my ballot to me and I can either mail it back or drop it in a ballot box at select locations around town. That can create fraud on its own.

There is no perfect system.

I don't think in my state you need all that but you might...

I voted no on Voter ID amendment in my state because it's pointless. Voter fraud is pretty much non-existant here so why pass the law? So we can spend money combating something that isn't a problem?

I think other reasons for voting against it are pretty silly, such as it disenfranchising students and the elderly. It's pretty god damn easy to get a valid ID with your current address in time for the election every year, and if not it's your own fault.

[Dmonix]

Weird that SA seem to have better systems in place to avoid multiple votes being cast by one person, you need to have your ID scanned and then they put long lasting paint on your nail to add to it.

The main difference though is that Obama passed a law or bill (Or so I heard) about monitoring where money from taxes is being spent whereas I was told this morning that in SA that nearly a billion rand was lost to corruption in the public services last year.

Well done to Obama on a second term, seems a better option than Romney at any rate. Good speech maker.

[curtthehurt1]

I might be rather conservative myself but I don't understand why ID card is such a no no. I mean fraud revealed sometimes by voters themselves, it should be the alarm ring to require an ID card and a list of the people from the city/county to make sure "Bob" isn't voting in every town in the county...thus facing cases where one person =! one vote.

The biggest problem with the voter ID laws comes to cost. Many Americans don't have State-issued ID, especially if they do not drive, because of the cost to get one. Even student IDs don't have all of the information the ID laws were requiring. The controversy became worse when they said IDs like Gun Licenses were valid forms of ID, making people hysterical that the "gun-toting Republicans" wouldn't have issues, but the "liberal youth" would be left out.

Added pressure came from the fact that the voter ID laws weren't addressed until 1 month ago, not giving the millions of Americans without valid IDs time to have them issued. When I first got my driver's license, I had it within 10 minutes of having my picture taken. Now, it takes 6 weeks to receive it in the mail (much like a Passport).

Of course voter ID laws were shot down. They didn't address all of the issues and didn't allow for the cost/time for everyone to receive them.

the way the ammendment was written up here in MN was that the state would supply the id 100% free of charge.

and voter fraud does sadly exist, in a lot of places there are 25-30% more registered voters than population legal to vote. most common involves the social security numbers of people who would be legal to vote aside from the fact that they also have death certificates in their names.