StarGateWars Forums

Kjarkur wrote:

Dovahkiin wrote:You should never trust your government. You moment you trust your government is the moment they turn on you.

I never said our country is perfect, in fact I said quite the opposite.

I carry a gun everywhere I go. Not because I'm scared not to, but because I know **Filtered** happens, doesn't matter if it is likely or not, it happens and if it happens to me I want to be prepared.

It's like how airlines have flotation devices. Being in a plane crash is already extremely rare, but your odds of actually surviving a ditching (emergency water landing) is astronomical.

But they still have them in case the unthinkable happens.

I never used the word perfect either - I know what you said. My question was, how is your freedom any different? Is the gun-laws of what you speak? Is the gun the freedom you speak of?

Regarding suicides, I'd like to know as well - but I think a lot of them are just due to people being sick in general and not getting the help they require.

Dr. Walter Bishop™ wrote:

Kjarkur wrote:

Dovahkiin wrote:You should never trust your government. You moment you trust your government is the moment they turn on you.

I never said our country is perfect, in fact I said quite the opposite.

I carry a gun everywhere I go. Not because I'm scared not to, but because I know **Filtered** happens, doesn't matter if it is likely or not, it happens and if it happens to me I want to be prepared.

It's like how airlines have flotation devices. Being in a plane crash is already extremely rare, but your odds of actually surviving a ditching (emergency water landing) is astronomical.

But they still have them in case the unthinkable happens.

I never used the word perfect either - I know what you said. My question was, how is your freedom any different? Is the gun-laws of what you speak? Is the gun the freedom you speak of?

Regarding suicides, I'd like to know as well - but I think a lot of them are just due to people being sick in general and not getting the help they require.

Hey KJ.
I am a bigtime liberal as Julliette can tell you, and I am strongly for guns, as it is a protected right that we have had since our inception as a country. And just because we don't have war on our soil at this moment, im not the one to be caught UNARMED when soldiers wanna rape my children or kidnap my wife. Also, an inanimate object does not harm anyone. A person does. Should there be a murder ban? Sure, there is already. And I can kill with traceless poison as easily as with a gun, easier even. Or a knife, or a frakkin Hatak Vessel. We have always allowed our citizens guns, because the government is part of society, it is not the whole of it. Another fact alot may not know, is before several cases of genicides, the citizens of that country were unarmed by their governments laws....

@ Jules - Are you suggesting that our country has more suicides because of the republicrats policies? I would hope not as that is a little rediculous.

Dr. Walter Bishop™ wrote:Hey KJ.
I am a bigtime liberal as Julliette can tell you, and I am strongly for guns, as it is a protected right that we have had since our inception as a country. And just because we don't have war on our soil at this moment, im not the one to be caught UNARMED when soldiers wanna rape my children or kidnap my wife. Also, an inanimate object does not harm anyone. A person does. Should there be a murder ban? Sure, there is already. And I can kill with traceless poison as easily as with a gun, easier even. Or a knife, or a frakkin Hatak Vessel. We have always allowed our citizens guns, because the government is part of society, it is not the whole of it. Another fact alot may not know, is before several cases of genicides, the citizens of that country were unarmed by their governments laws....

@ Jules - Are you suggesting that our country has more suicides because of the republicrats policies? I would hope not as that is a little rediculous.

[KMA]Avenger wrote:LOL, do you seriously think KJ will pay attention to any of that, or to look at how history repeats itself?

curtthehurt1 wrote:

Kjarkur wrote:It's extremely low. But our prison is a 5 star hotel compared to US Prisons.

In there they get a job, have internet access, can get weekend's off to visit the city or family, can get any college/uni education they want, government helps them to become members of society again.
We believe in less sentences and actually focusing harder on improving the individuals, instead of having them locked up half their life.

I'm not sure about how exactly it works but this is what I know. I'll look the rate up for you and post later today.

-KJ

No kidding about the 5 star hotel man. lol. One of the hardest things for the US felons is that a large portion of businesses will not hire anyone with a criminal record. so they may only get a 3 year charge and get out, but a life of crime gives them more benefits than making an honest living once they have committed once. Their jail cell offers them more amenities than they could get with the jobs they get stuck in after getting out of prison. basically what iceland has is the opportunity to come out of jail qualified for a $70,000-80,000+, job, instead of having to settle for a $30,000-35,000 a year job that you have difficulty finding because you are a "criminal".

I think that has a LOT more to do with the murder and crime than any weapons availabilty.

aside from that, we live in a society that is changing today.we are a society that wants more freedoms; marijuana legalization is a big topic, as is gay marriage. I am Ok with both being allowed legally. I dont really care who marries who. If you want to have your weed, I'm not going to stop you, but if you do anything that is going to put people at risk such as driving while you are stoned, or you show up to work stoned (I work construction, if you arent all there, **Filtered** can get serious really quick) and I find out about it, I will have no qualms about breaking your jaw. I went to school and was friends with a few people whom were gay, as well as quite a number of heavy weed smokers. The only stipulations that I put on either of those types was a "not around me" policy. I made it nicely clear that i did NOT want to watch a guy and his boyfriend make out, and i made it clear that if you wanted to smoke your pot, go somewhere where the fumes wont affect me, and no I wasnt going to share. Those people who were my friends understood my reasoning, and we never had any problems.

and now with all the gun debates going up and both of those other issues getting on solid footing, I find a lot of those friends of mine whom supported marijuana and gay marriage ranting on their facebooks to "ban assault rifles" and as I mentioned before, the weapons that are classified by the term assault rifles are all but banned here, and dont ever get used for crimes when legally purchased (which is extremely difficult and expensive), with the exception of ONE incident since 1934 *which incedentally was a cop*. What the general public is mistaking for those assault rifles are actually semi automatic versions of the assault rifles, all which are commonly used for hunting due to their ease of use and flexibility. In the southern united states, such as texas and louisiana, wild boar are a big problem as far as causing property damage, and many of the people who hunt them legally to get them out of problem areas use AR's, because you can switch from day vision scopes to night vision in a matter of minutes, and you can easily add supressors so that you can hunt at night without anyone unable to sleep because of the sound of gunfire.

In reality rifles as a whole only account for 3% of gun crime. basically, every weapon that was banned by the clinton gun law (including suppressors) was used in less than 2% of crime. and considering that nearly half of murders are committed where the victim and killer know each other, it wouldnt be all that difficult to use another type of weapon other than a gun for the murder, it's more of a weapon of opportunity. and another 50% or so of murders are related to gangs, whom have easy access to black market guns if they are unable to aquire legally purchased ones.

Dovahkiin wrote:KJ, you say this discussion is about weighing the good and bad of guns, yet continue to ignore the statistics.

Kjarkur wrote:

[KMA]Avenger wrote:LOL, do you seriously think KJ will pay attention to any of that, or to look at how history repeats itself?

Is it very difficult for you to keep this a debate without insults?

Of course I look at it. If you read up on history, shootings where innocent people are killed, also repeats itself. I'm only trying to keep up the debate, which one is more important. The innocent life's lost, or the life's the guns safe. But the topic is about a possible change, so I can understand why you are on the fence. You don't like change, I get that.

But I guess it's alright if lots and lots of other people die as long as you get to keep your precious gun.

curtthehurt1 wrote:

Kjarkur wrote:It's extremely low. But our prison is a 5 star hotel compared to US Prisons.

In there they get a job, have internet access, can get weekend's off to visit the city or family, can get any college/uni education they want, government helps them to become members of society again.
We believe in less sentences and actually focusing harder on improving the individuals, instead of having them locked up half their life.

I'm not sure about how exactly it works but this is what I know. I'll look the rate up for you and post later today.

-KJ

No kidding about the 5 star hotel man. lol. One of the hardest things for the US felons is that a large portion of businesses will not hire anyone with a criminal record. so they may only get a 3 year charge and get out, but a life of crime gives them more benefits than making an honest living once they have committed once. Their jail cell offers them more amenities than they could get with the jobs they get stuck in after getting out of prison. basically what iceland has is the opportunity to come out of jail qualified for a $70,000-80,000+, job, instead of having to settle for a $30,000-35,000 a year job that you have difficulty finding because you are a "criminal".

I think that has a LOT more to do with the murder and crime than any weapons availabilty.

aside from that, we live in a society that is changing today.we are a society that wants more freedoms; marijuana legalization is a big topic, as is gay marriage. I am Ok with both being allowed legally. I dont really care who marries who. If you want to have your weed, I'm not going to stop you, but if you do anything that is going to put people at risk such as driving while you are stoned, or you show up to work stoned (I work construction, if you arent all there, **Filtered** can get serious really quick) and I find out about it, I will have no qualms about breaking your jaw. I went to school and was friends with a few people whom were gay, as well as quite a number of heavy weed smokers. The only stipulations that I put on either of those types was a "not around me" policy. I made it nicely clear that i did NOT want to watch a guy and his boyfriend make out, and i made it clear that if you wanted to smoke your pot, go somewhere where the fumes wont affect me, and no I wasnt going to share. Those people who were my friends understood my reasoning, and we never had any problems.

and now with all the gun debates going up and both of those other issues getting on solid footing, I find a lot of those friends of mine whom supported marijuana and gay marriage ranting on their facebooks to "ban assault rifles" and as I mentioned before, the weapons that are classified by the term assault rifles are all but banned here, and dont ever get used for crimes when legally purchased (which is extremely difficult and expensive), with the exception of ONE incident since 1934 *which incedentally was a cop*. What the general public is mistaking for those assault rifles are actually semi automatic versions of the assault rifles, all which are commonly used for hunting due to their ease of use and flexibility. In the southern united states, such as texas and louisiana, wild boar are a big problem as far as causing property damage, and many of the people who hunt them legally to get them out of problem areas use AR's, because you can switch from day vision scopes to night vision in a matter of minutes, and you can easily add supressors so that you can hunt at night without anyone unable to sleep because of the sound of gunfire.

In reality rifles as a whole only account for 3% of gun crime. basically, every weapon that was banned by the clinton gun law (including suppressors) was used in less than 2% of crime. and considering that nearly half of murders are committed where the victim and killer know each other, it wouldnt be all that difficult to use another type of weapon other than a gun for the murder, it's more of a weapon of opportunity. and another 50% or so of murders are related to gangs, whom have easy access to black market guns if they are unable to aquire legally purchased ones.

[/spoiler]

Kjarkur wrote:Excellent post, thank you for that. You can't really be pro-gay marriage though if you don't want to see them. Either they are free to be a couple or not. You can look away but you can't ban them from being in love near you. So I disagree with you on that.
-Regarding the murders, you make a good case - It's always the same, the more poor people get, up goes the crime rate. And if they wont get hired after jail. that's exactly what will happen.

Here the government basically forces them to get jobs, just makes it happen. And lots of companies get a bonus I believe if they help convicts get back on their feet. Perhaps that would work out for US.

Dovahkiin wrote:I staunchly oppose any sort of mental check.

Dovahkiin wrote:No. I am also opposed to background checks and I think domestic violence laws are out of control.