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Sol wrote:

reborn wrote:I can see your post but imo you have counter acted it by stopping active users that's ascended big the lack of turns.

So ppl that was inactive and couldn't give a **Filtered** about ascended now see a market to use their turns and sell for naq again not giving a **Filtered** about ascended just to get more in main.

Maybe that's to hard to understand

. Shall I just explain again?
I just proved that you get MORE dmu/lf if you let it convert your APP over TC than a person converting to turns.
Assuming you farm as well.

Want me to summarise it?
You don't convert to turns + you farm with HALF your normal turn generation > you convert to turns + you farming normally.

It favours both sides I require, you get a little bonus but you wont surpass the normal farmers if you don't farm yourself. That being said, if you farm as well you will get a fair bit more than them.
Big ascenders DON'T NEED EXTRA TURNS IT WOULD BE OVERKILL, they would already get more DMU if they actually played the damn game and not complain about how they should get more APP's because they can't be bothered to farm.

Am I missing something in your argument? Or are you still not understanding?

Perhaps this?

Anyway I ll sum it up again real short


What is not taken into account here is the investment of NAQ players paid for "huge" ascension which was the last time I checked around 1 quadrillion of main NAQ

So you can add that to the loss of a player ascending big. So instead of that right now 1Q of NAQ is being used to trade for DMU directly and ascend lightly, after all it does save you the wait as well.

In other words if we make a comparison:

Player A ascending big:
- loss of NAQ
- loss of ability to make a turn conversion
- gain of LF which is a bit over the loss of being able to farm with those additional turns
- gain of 1 ascended level

Player B ascending small:
- no loss of naq (in comparison to player A naturally)
- ability to convert AP to turns
- gain of 1 ascended level

The simple question we ask ourselves therefor is. Who ascended in a better way?
Player A or Player B? Or to put it better. Do we follow path A or B?

Each can answer that question on his own.

There is where I personally (perhaps only one playing ascended) see the problem lies of not having the ATs being refilled like the rest and that is why I believe large ascensions are no longer viable, or smart, which I do not think was the intention in the first place, but rather to simply not make ascension boosts in short amount of time.


But anyway I think this topic is probably overdone and long past. Players will adapt to whatever mechanics there are in place. Therefor I think that all you can do is express your view on something, perhaps add some additional input, to explain to the others, your way of thinking, but then you should move on and if there is no change what you have to do is adapt.

SVaRuN wrote:

Sol wrote:

reborn wrote:I can see your post but imo you have counter acted it by stopping active users that's ascended big the lack of turns.

So ppl that was inactive and couldn't give a **Filtered** about ascended now see a market to use their turns and sell for naq again not giving a **Filtered** about ascended just to get more in main.

Maybe that's to hard to understand

. Shall I just explain again?
I just proved that you get MORE dmu/lf if you let it convert your APP over TC than a person converting to turns.
Assuming you farm as well.

Want me to summarise it?
You don't convert to turns + you farm with HALF your normal turn generation > you convert to turns + you farming normally.

It favours both sides I require, you get a little bonus but you wont surpass the normal farmers if you don't farm yourself. That being said, if you farm as well you will get a fair bit more than them.
Big ascenders DON'T NEED EXTRA TURNS IT WOULD BE OVERKILL, they would already get more DMU if they actually played the damn game and not complain about how they should get more APP's because they can't be bothered to farm.

Am I missing something in your argument? Or are you still not understanding?

Perhaps this?

Anyway I ll sum it up again real short


What is not taken into account here is the investment of NAQ players paid for "huge" ascension which was the last time I checked around 1 quadrillion of main NAQ

So you can add that to the loss of a player ascending big. So instead of that right now 1Q of NAQ is being used to trade for DMU directly and ascend lightly, after all it does save you the wait as well.

I'm not going to add it to the loss mainly because there is no gun to someones head forcing them to ascend with massive stats, caps have been around for awhile even before I changed it to a trickle conversion, there were probably a few caught in the cross fire sure, but I would imagine those that ascended under the cap would have technically converted it all by now.
Though by any means, this APP bottleneck is to effectively stop those big ascensions of naq so there isn't $$ being thrown at ascended. So it's doing quite well.

SVaRuN wrote: Player A ascending big:
- loss of NAQ <- chose to
- loss of ability to make a turn conversion
- gain of LF which is a bit over the loss of being able to farm with those additional turns <- doesn't have to do as much work at all to be better than player B.
- gain of 1 ascended level

Player B ascending small:
- no loss of naq (in comparison to player A naturally)
- ability to convert AP to turns
- gain of 1 ascended level

Added two thingys to the above.
Your assumption is based on the fact both players can farm rich mines of dmu, and in fact player B will farm continuously passed player A to keep up with the LF.
This representation is invalid for 'small' players though, the ones that the APP -> LF was actually meant for, the LF gained compared to dmu farmed would be huge and anyone would be stupid not to ascend large.
(see calcs above somewhere, I did them twice, tziki did them as well)

SVaRuN wrote: But anyway I think this topic is probably overdone and long past. Players will adapt to whatever mechanics there are in place. Therefor I think that all you can do is express your view on something, perhaps add some additional input, to explain to the others, your way of thinking, but then you should move on and if there is no change what you have to do is adapt.

As impossible as it seems to change my mind, I would be happy to (as I have no real value in the issue) as long as it's needed - I'm not going to open the flood gates on turns or app because it would **Filtered** over the internal economy. But it's not needed and no one has convinced me otherwise. Even at a large scale big players are still doing better without the turn conversion than their counterparts, and they're doing less work!

son goku wrote:This all seems very silly stating that it stops people buying stats on ascended.... If people want to buy stats on ascended they will just buy NAQ for $$ then trade it for DMU ... so not only can people still buy their way into a top spot on ascended but it also heavily limits the newcomers and non $$ spending players even further!
!

cbf explaining or correcting you, so I'll just leave it with this reply.

Sol wrote:

son goku wrote:This all seems very silly stating that it stops people buying stats on ascended.... If people want to buy stats on ascended they will just buy NAQ for $$ then trade it for DMU ... so not only can people still buy their way into a top spot on ascended but it also heavily limits the newcomers and non $$ spending players even further!
!

cbf explaining or correcting you, so I'll just leave it with this reply.

That would be because he is right? if people want to spend $$ on ascended they can, and will.

Well just ask sol he gives Quints out . How you think i got my acc ... SOL-founded

1Quint= 100 $

100$ per quint seems a good enough deal.

I approve

~Tziki~ wrote:

Sol wrote:

son goku wrote:This all seems very silly stating that it stops people buying stats on ascended.... If people want to buy stats on ascended they will just buy NAQ for $$ then trade it for DMU ... so not only can people still buy their way into a top spot on ascended but it also heavily limits the newcomers and non $$ spending players even further!
!

cbf explaining or correcting you, so I'll just leave it with this reply.

That would be because he is right? if people want to spend $$ on ascended they can, and will.

"sol can't be bothered replying, therefore he can't reply because he's wrong"
I imagine your thought process goes something like that. Sure I'll reply, so I can expand your through processes.

Son Goku, my comment about stopping $$ being thrown at ascended IS WELL IN THE CONTEXT of it being wrought FROM ascensions through naq. Do I expect every $$ hole to be plugged? No, do I want every $$ hole to be plugged? I don't really care. People pay for services all the time, this game is free to play, I'm not charging anything.
If people want to buy stats on ascended then good luck to them, there is only so much dmu you can farm and trade, and the lack-of just increases prices, and by any measure if you want to stop people farming for others then you should shoot every alliance down.
Ehhhmmm how did you come up with that conclusion ? You expect APP -> LF to be the answer, as if it pales in comparison to the current $$ spending, as if it will allow people to be competitive? HAH!

bump, still waiting for a reason WHY NOT after proving others wrong.

cbf ? cant bother **Filtered** replying ?

Jesus christ Sol, you are one arrogant **Filtered**.
You behave as if all that crap you made on ascended is logical and everyone should understand.

It clearly is not.
And of course you will either ignore or post some rude comment about the players being idiots and children. Guess what, almost everyone in this game is 20+.

I hear people left and right complaining about how they fear going up against you on anything ascended related, seems like you can not take some criticism for some of the poor work you did. Granted not everything was poor or bugged, but a lot was/is.

For instance, I find it appalling how many bugs you have had with the rewards from the tournaments and how you are now personally handing them out.

You sweep issues under the rug and act all bold and arrogant while it looks to me you have not had 1 tounament without bugs and issues.
I would think you would be a little more humble in your responses towards the players that are actually suposed to play the ascended server.

It is the players game, not yours.

Getting all tetchy with each other is never going to get you anyplace. Sol has made his position on the subject fairly clear, you just need to adapt to it and come up with other suggestions.

For example, an alternative suggestion would be thus:-

Give the player three choices for APP conversion.
1) the existing trickle conversion, APP converting to life force each TC.
2) the existing all APP for 4k turns option.
3) a new, 'I want my life force and I want it now' option that converts all your APP into LF at a reduced ratio compared to the trickle feed option. Say between 50-75% efficiency of the trickle feed.

So, you can leave it trickling for max efficiency, you can get it all now for reduced efficiency, or you can blow it all on turns.

Compromise.

Ingólfur wrote:cbf ? cant bother **Filtered** replying ?

Jesus christ Sol, you are one arrogant **Filtered**.
You behave as if all that crap you made on ascended is logical and everyone should understand.

It clearly is not.
And of course you will either ignore or post some rude comment about the players being idiots and children. Guess what, almost everyone in this game is 20+.

Why bother replying when I'll just say the same stuff over and over? Tziki hasn't shown any reason that the APP converting on TC isn't beneficial when compared to a normal farming person.
Secondly the APP wasn't meant for a high end person but new accounts - which a min of 400 bill per day is obviously helping them to a point I would probably call ridiculous.

I don't really get why the post was made here... it seems to be more for it's own thread than this one. And yes I argue with all suggestions, there's no point in throwing one in without discussing all the issues that could amount from it and then solving them.

the voting looks like its speaking for itself... and when i was new with my multi i looked at that 400bil a day like a joke dude!

i guess i can have Sol's sttitude now though as im done ascending and now its pointless to bother.. right Sol?

KOS wrote:the voting looks like its speaking for itself... and when i was new with my multi i looked at that 400bil a day like a joke dude!

Then you have outgrown the use of APP then.

As for the tally, I made a post about that somewhere above.