StarGateWars Forums

Mordack wrote:

Casshern wrote:sorry but you can not have a situation were the mods police themselves and the admins are just glorified mods with more power and therefore they can not police the mods or themselves. That is why we need an ombudsman position. Now there was a time when bias was clear shown by mods on the forum and general clear out of the bad seeds and the ombudsman position, stopped this. If the ombudsman position is gone who is there to stop the abuse of the power that mods and admins wheeled. where do people with genuine complaints go if we have no ombudsman and for all the stupid ones its not right to not allow the righteous ones to be cleared. In rl the ombudsman would be truly neutral and from outside the game but since this is unlikely to happen a player from the game is the best option we have. The voting for it is flawed, a new system will have to be used for the election of an ombudsman.

Even if all of the mods and the admin were corrupt, what could the ombudsman do about it?

The answer is nothing. He has no actual power to remove moderators or nullify warnings. All he can do is make recommendations to the admin, which they then review and act as they see fit; and if the admin was bias, then they'd just ignore him.

All the ombudsman does is look at cases and refer them onto the admin with an opinion. That opinion doesn't have to be followed, and the admin just end up looking at the evidence themselves and making an opinion. As someone has pointed out, it's basically just a middleman.

This!

firstly noobert AND Meth. Hate to say it guys but Megan and I have been hopping on the bad foot to do the good thing for quite some time. She regularly flies into england - just can't get enough of me. Met at a night club in London just after the Transformers I premier.

Finally.. as for the topic at hand.

How about we actually forget the insignificant problem every brain dead zombie realised ninety thousand years ago and I focus on something more to the point.

Digi. Are you actually being serious?

YOU good sir.. get your lazy bloody ass up to Jason and get his god dam attention to main SGW. Do your actual job!

I feel if you were conveying to him with half the attempted conviction you used in this absolutely trifle - pointless - matter just how anarchic and empty his game is then we might have had some margin of improvements when you first got the job some moons ago.

If this has been done, then I am waiting for some feedback from you.

How about that?

Okay smart guy, want to see some IRC logs? How about my phone bill? I've racked up a crap load of $$$ calling him and texting him about issues. As I said to FreeSpirit during this week's admin meet (which only Jason, FS and I attended), I can say all I want to Jason, but he does his own thing at his own pace.

Caprila wrote:In a perfect situation, the ombudsman would not be needed, as users and mods would be able to solve issues, clearly and calmly themselves.

However, we don't have a perfect situation here, we have a work in progress, that still requires it's presence imo. Perhaps we will get to the point Ombudsman is not needed, or perhaps not. But for now, I think we still do.

I agree with Caprila. The Ombudsman staff review conflict between Forum Users and the Moderators. If this service was not needed then people would not be using it.

REK wrote:whats the point I called deni an 80 year old drunk cause she was stuttering and robe felt I was seaking about her so had earendil 's crybaby ass warn me for it then I made a thread pointing out robes abuse of power since she felt offended by me calling deni and old drunk since and im only speculating that robe truely is an old drunk she deleted my thread and every post I talk about it in lol this place is a joke

This case is a good example as to why we need the Ombudsman Office.

When a player logdes a complaint with the Ombudsman Staff they can review Moderator Records and interview Forum Staff to ascertain what happened and whether Staff Practices need to be reviewed and improved.

In this case, if REK wanted to know what happened, he could have lodged a complaint and discovered that a moderator asked me on msn if I believed calling someone "an 80 year old drunk" was an insult and I said yes. I didnt know who the insult was directed to when I made that decision because I was not logged onto forums. I was then given a link, logged onto forums and after reading the context and previous posts, still believed that the post was a violation of the forum rules.

The moderator did their job and issued a warning. REK then complained and the moderator appropriately moved his subsequent post to the dump.

Perception does not equal objective reality.

Some people think that they are above the rules. That is exactly why we need the ombudsman staff becasue no one, including the Forum Staff, are above the rules.

If anyone can think of a constructive way to improve the Ombudsman Office, please message the Ombudsman Staff and Forum Admins.

That would mean the Administration / Mod Staff cannot be seen as a fair group, with the best interests of the forum at heart?
Worse, it would mean said groups cannot communicate to the extent that agreement can be reached.

That's weak.

DaDigi wrote:Okay smart guy, want to see some IRC logs? How about my phone bill? I've racked up a crap load of $$$ calling him and texting him about issues. As I said to FreeSpirit during this week's admin meet (which only Jason, FS and I attended), I can say all I want to Jason, but he does his own thing at his own pace.

That's what we wanted to read.

Tetrismonkey wrote:I think the "WTH" as you so boldly put it, should have a bigger role than just bringing warnings to the Admins attention. They should also act as the hub, the middle person, for many other aspects of the forums, such as suggestions and things like that. IDK atm, im a bit tired and cant see or think straight, but non the less, the obudsman should play a bigger role. There job is important to the forum, as much as a mods job is.

That IS the Ombudsman's job. However the true purpose of the Ombudsman has been eroded over time and taken a backseat to ingame politics. The Ombudsman is no longer about trying to help facilitate communication between the users and the admins/mods(which is the true purpose of the position), but merely an outlet for disgruntled users to attack the mods with which they hold a grudge and for trolls to seek immunity from the rules.


It is for that reason, combined with the Ombudsman's lust for power, that I must agree with Mordack. The position is no longer needed, it has been perverted and no longer accomplishes anything in the way or beneficial but rather serves to further divide the mods and users causing more trouble than it's worth.

I support either a radical reform of this position, or it's removal from the forum. As it stands right now, however, the office is pointless and wholly unnecessary.

And I'm sorry to double post, but I think a lot of your are misrepresenting some of our motivations for calling his office into doubt. We're not looking to crush the last forum opposition beneath our jackboots. Surely you can realize that the office as it exists at the moment is just pointless?

I can support changes to the ombudsman position, if the majority of the forum users feel it's necessary. Heck, I'd even support giving them more powers. But supporting an office which does nothing and only creates work for others? No way, hose.

Semper wrote:firstly noobert AND Meth. Hate to say it guys but Megan and I have been hopping on the bad foot to do the good thing for quite some time. She regularly flies into england - just can't get enough of me. Met at a night club in London just after the Transformers I premier.

You son of a ....

Universe wrote:That would mean the Administration / Mod Staff cannot be seen as a fair group, with the best interests of the forum at heart?
Worse, it would mean said groups cannot communicate to the extent that agreement can be reached.

Forum staff are not Omnipotent.

I think the community benefits from having an external team, such as the ombudsman staff, review complaints about Forum staff.

Could this office be improved - Yes.
Should the Ombudsman Staff have more power - Yes.

However, I have not seen any constructive or tangible suggestions here that the Ombudsman and Administration Staff can work with and take forward.

So maybe a formal review like Mordack suggests would be useful but only if the Forum Community are extensively consulted and heard.

The Ombudsman Office is elected by the Community for the Community.

Mordack wrote:
Even if all of the mods and the admin were corrupt, what could the ombudsman do about it?

The answer is nothing. He has no actual power to remove moderators or nullify warnings. All he can do is make recommendations to the admin, which they then review and act as they see fit; and if the admin was bias, then they'd just ignore him.

All the ombudsman does is look at cases and refer them onto the admin with an opinion. That opinion doesn't have to be followed, and the admin just end up looking at the evidence themselves and making an opinion. As someone has pointed out, it's basically just a middleman.

well that was my misunderstanding of what an ombudsman is (in ireland they are a check and balance) otherwise what are they but a waste of space on the forums

Robe wrote:Forum staff are not Omnipotent.

she got something right

Robe wrote:The Ombudsman Office is elected by the Community for the Community.

its not even an proper election, just the bigger alliances all getting there members to vote. a system of one vote per alliance would be better. Less likely than that bigger alliances will win though nefarious means.

secret vote that is

I think we all agree that the last election was a farce ... extended voting times, ingame id checks etc