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this could work, but the bonuses for being unascended would need to be increased, as with the new system proposed here, noone could be good player and be unascended...

as for the jaffa-tok'ra thing, one solution might be:

remove connections between the ascended and unascended races, so that when one ascends, one has to choose race to become, that way, the Jaffa/tok'ra problem and the asgard/ancient problem would both be solved...

I dont think choosing your ascended race is a good idea either it will just make the game more confusing, for what? one race? Think of it this way, the Tok'ra and regular Go'auld are basically the same thing. Tok'ra even pose as minor Go'auld to battle them more effectively. In the show they aren't a very powerful race they are few in numbers, have little resources and are constantly running away. Does this sound like an ascended race to you?? Thy need the help of the Tauri, and free jaffa to even make a dent in the Go'auld's power. I would suggest to just stop considering this idea.
As for the Asgard/Ancient thing it makes more sense than you think Asgard are an advanced race of humans (Thor says something like, We were once much like you, to Oneill) and Ancients are a VERY advanced race of human so it does make sense that the Asgard could go Ancient by advancing far enough. Finally, the Tollan are a very powerful race not only in wepons but in all other technical aspects of life. The were more powerful than the System Lords at one time, but the System Lords were trying to surpass them, the Tollan weren't.

Both have symbiots...

One race brutally controls others and fights among itself. The other race merely resists such actions.

BTW, this is said with a sense of RPing, which a Tok`ra race could bring back.

Ok this is not an argument of the tok'ra's morale values because it is not very important in this game. What is important is their power and tech. Their tech... it is all the same as the Goa'uld minus the cave forming crystals. The free jaffa, they have the same exact tech as goa'uld w/o the goa'uld controlling them, so basically minus hand devices but the rest is the same. Both of these races' power is vastly less than the Goa'uld (the tok'ra were jumping w/ glee when they got one mothership).
It is almost like changing Tauri to American Tauri, then creating Switzerland Tauri, their have almost the same tech but are weaker... why? if it is because they have a different name that is a pretty weak argument

Yeah, but all ascended have pretty much the same weapons and such. Plus, Nanotimasters? They don't even exist in the series to my knowledge, yet they still exist ingame (though there is a move to change them to Asurans). If we go by the series, Replicators are dead, Asgard are dead, and Tollan are dead.

TBH, the game stopped going by the series long ago, it gives people a new toy to play with and will allow the Tok`ra to show their faces in game, instead of just being a forum movement. I know two powerful players that would jump at such an oppurtunity.

actually, the tok'ra have several technologies that the goa'uld dont have...
Tok'ra bio-sensor
Tok'ra communicator
Tok'ra data pad
Tok'ra memory device
Tok'ra poison
Tok'ra strength gauge
Tok'ra subspace network
Tok'ra subspace receiver
Tok'ra tunnels
+ tech for removing symbiotes alive w/o killing host

and probably several others...

Zeratul wrote:actually, the tok'ra have several technologies that the goa'uld dont have...
Tok'ra bio-sensor
Tok'ra communicator
Tok'ra data pad
Tok'ra memory device
Tok'ra poison
Tok'ra strength gauge
Tok'ra subspace network
Tok'ra subspace receiver
Tok'ra tunnels
+ tech for removing symbiotes alive w/o killing host

and probably several others...

Thanks for that - death to all tok'ra haters...




The Host of Teal'auc,
Johauna


(side-note: it's RP, so don't think ol Jenny lowered herself wishing death to someone in rl)

Tbh, I still think bringing Tok'ra as ascended race would be no harm - just these biased enough don't want them there... what harm does it make to them, right?



Teal'auc

The Four Horsemen wrote:

Tollan Phoenix wrote:New Ascended Race: Tok`ra
Those Free Jaffa that prove themselves are blended with a Tok`ra symbiont. These people refuse to bend to System Lord domination and continue to resist wherever they are. Again, any ideas for weapons/techs are welcome.

One huge problem Jaffa cannot blend with Go'auld(or Tok'ra though it is the same), Tealc says this on many occasions. And as shown in the shown in the show the free jaffa and Tok'ra aren't exactly friends. I dont like the idea caus they are basically the same thing as the go'auld... Seems kind of useless to have another go'auld race just w/ a diff bonus. Also Tok'ra aren't that much a step up from jaffa they are almost at the same level of tech except... the strange voices.

Actually in the episode where SG1 go back to the sixties he clearly says that when his snake matures it can take him over.........Jaffa cant be hosts as long as they have a symbiote in their pouch

Zeratul wrote:actually, the tok'ra have several technologies that the goa'uld dont have...
Tok'ra bio-sensor
Tok'ra communicator
Tok'ra data pad
Tok'ra memory device
Tok'ra poison
Tok'ra strength gauge
Tok'ra subspace network
Tok'ra subspace receiver
Tok'ra tunnels
+ tech for removing symbiotes alive w/o killing host

and probably several others...

That just proves how lame the Tok'ra are these are horrible tech and weapons for example, the poison will only kill goa'uld and just by having it they are risking their own lives. And the only way to make these people even remotely seem like they are worth playing they need goa'uld weapons then just play as a goa'uld. This is a horrible race and a horrible idea and i say if you do do it do it to quantum or chaos dont let it pollute the main server

The Four Horsemen wrote:That just proves how lame the Tok'ra are these are horrible tech and weapons for example, the poison will only kill goa'uld and just by having it they are risking their own lives. And the only way to make these people even remotely seem like they are worth playing they need goa'uld weapons then just play as a goa'uld. This is a horrible race and a horrible idea and i say if you do do it do it to quantum or chaos dont let it pollute the main server

Well, people like you can really annoy me...
Tok'ra are fine race, and nobody would force you to chose the race as yours if we would be lucky to have it implemented. It does NO harm to the gameplay if new ascended races next to current Tollans, Nanotimasters, SystemLords would be introduced, as there races are, and I stress it again, TOTALLY THE SAME stats wise - and only your personal dislike for tok'ra should bias and limit those, who'd want to choose Tok'ra as race?




Teal'auc

I believe I suggested in the Asuran thread that people be allowed to choose their shown race.
ie.
Human/Tauri
Replicator/Human-form Replicator
NanoTiMaster/Asuran

And then we could just add:
Goa'uld/Tok'ra

and potentially;
System Lord/Tok'ra System Lord
(or something)

In addition, I think people should think about reversing the Asgard and the Tollan. They're both very defencive races in terms of their tech, and Ancients are just so clearly the advanced humans (however, Tollans ARE equally human). Then again, that's where the ascended races (Ajnu, Indu, Ori and Tollah) come in.

And finally, I agree about the replicators having a UP bonus... It just makes sense. And I agree with the suggested method in the original post about how to act on it.

(I'm not sure about how part 2 works, due to not knowing the normal stat-changes, and will therefore keep my big mouth out of it)

Part two is not good. I'm putting Urogard's suggestion in.

Teal'auc of the Tok'ra wrote:
Tok'ra are NOT the same as goa'uld... and that is thing i'd be able to flame about for ages. Not here, to save our beloved moderators nerves...

I was watching Satrgate Sg-1 and the episode "tok'ra" part 1 was on and something Cordesh said that solidified my point better than i could ask. He said, "We are infiltrators. We work from within the Goa'uld. Therefore it is important that we appear to be, Goa'uld."
This shows me once and for all that they are (other than morale values, obvious weakness, and those crystal caves) the Goa'uld and this game would have to present them as such because they have all the same tech and would be no different than playing as a Goa'uld under a different name. And for the record i have never hated the Tok'ra until you have so forcefully pushed for them to be put where they obviously don't belong.