Re: June 29th Updates (big / many...)
Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 2:46 pm
will any one anser my questions about the survays
These are the forums for the GateWa.rs family of text-based space-centred PBBGs
https://talk.gatewa.rs/
Wepwaet wrote:[spoiler]Neimenljivi wrote:Wepwaet wrote:[spoiler][/spoiler]BMMJ13 wrote:Forum wrote:i like em too, but not going to make this release.
not to say cannot be added if deemed required up the road slightly...MaxSterling wrote:Planet theft current issues :
- Target can be stripped of all planets
- Target can only get back 1 of his planets
- Attacker usually has nothing of value to mass back
Possible solutions :- Target can be stripped of all planets
- Target can only get back 1 of his planets
- Maximum 5 planets lost/day
- Make recovering planets only take 8 hours before they can take another planet. This allows an attacker to recover at least 2 planets before the protection kicks in... IF he notices quick enough.( It takes 12 hours before an attacker can protect the planet )- Attacker usually has nothing of value to mass back
- Attacker must fully arm all slots on MS (*excluding fleets. Only Volleys and Shields [Thx SS])
- Fleets cannot be sold off before the 12 hours it takes for the planet to be under the attackers control.
- MS cannot be sent away for 24 hours from the time the planet was taken. ( Make it the equivalent of sending the MS out for a planet )
- PPT cannot be set for 12 hours after a planet theft to give the target a chance at retaliation.
Players please poke holes in these ideas.
I don't feel you should reward failure (allowing your planet to be stolen) with something more to mass than already there.
-Fleets can be sold now right after attacking, meaning you only get to use the fleets on that planet or
-Full MS doesn't seem like that big of a deal, but it's not really related to the Planet. If a planet has a big defense, then you need to arm the fleets, they in and of themself are something to mass.
-MS can not be sent out for 4 hours I believe already? That's more than enough time for an active enough alliance to mass the persons fleets or MS already.
-PPT cannot be sent? So basically you have to choose whether to set PPT or steal a planet for the next day.
Decently defended planets already take multiple turns, where you could lose your fleets to another Mothership, a Player being online and moving platforms onto the planet or even merlining the planet, yet you want to make it riskier for those stealing the planets? I'm pretty sure it already is risky and expensive to mass planets, and with all the other Planet updates it makes even less sense.
Tell me BMMJ13, where is the risk if you can sell your fleets right after taking a planet? If anything you shouldn't be allowed to sell them off during that 4 hour window so that there IS something to retaliate against.
@ Forum
Could you include fleets not being sellable during that 4 hour period? A person should be able to strike back at what hurt them afterall.
Also if not in this group of updates could you consider the splitting of different types of messages in a future update(maybe when you re-evaluate the new updates). Peace/war settings, alliance messages, regular messages, market messages, etc...
Wepwaet, like BMMJ13 pointed out, should one be rewarded for playing carelessly or just having an ego big enough for thinking his planets are untouchable and being proven wrong?
For big planets you need about 30 mins to mass them down, you usually have your MS full just in case someone decides to mass you while you're doing it so you can mass a full MS in next 4 hours already.
Like said - if you're online you can move platforms which can destroy fleets, you can also merlin planet or mass opponent's fleets.
It's enough expensive and risky, the planet massing, as it is.
@Forum - thanks for decreasing the percentage to 15
~N
[/Spoiler]
Just because you build a full MS to protect your fleets doesn't mean most people do Neim. Forum put in the 4 hour rule to give people a chance to strike back at those who would hit and flee, this would just close a loophole in that rule. It's a good thing to ask for since Forum is trying to close loopholes used by those who hit others and risk nothing themselves.
You're thinking of one scenario. What about the lone wolf player that gets planet stripped by an alliance of snipers?BMMJ13 wrote:I don't feel you should reward failure (allowing your planet to be stolen) with something more to mass than already there.
When you send a MS out to find a planet, it's not the fleets that are gone... it's the entire MS. Therefore I'm guessing that the MS is responsible for towing the planet, while the fleets are strictly used to engage the defenses.BMMJ13 wrote:-Full MS doesn't seem like that big of a deal, but it's not really related to the Planet.
I thought it was only 3 hours, but my reasoning for extending this was because a planet is not in your control and cannot be protected for 12 hours, therefore the MS should need to tow the planet the full distance. Not be sent out to find another planet when the stolen planet isn't even in your control yet.BMMJ13 wrote:-MS can not be sent out for 4 hours I believe already? That's more than enough time for an active enough alliance to mass the persons fleets or MS already.
If a planet can't be protected until 12 hours has passed, then PPT shouldn't be permitted to be set. This was to stop everyone from hit and run without a chance at retaliation. Imagine having 5 planets stripped and all planets dumped with nothing to retaliate against.BMMJ13 wrote:-PPT cannot be sent? So basically you have to choose whether to set PPT or steal a planet for the next day.
BMMJ13 wrote:Decently defended planets already take multiple turns, where you could lose your fleets to another Mothership, a Player being online and moving platforms onto the planet or even merlining the planet, yet you want to make it riskier for those stealing the planets? I'm pretty sure it already is risky and expensive to mass planets, and with all the other Planet updates it makes even less sense.
chris wrote:could some one explain the survays for naq to me
is there a limit
do you have to be 18
how much you get
and other stuff about it
Planet stripping is a part of the game, I don't think it's necessary to change how it works any more than the 5 planets in 24 hours already. Maybe the ability to steal more back in that time period or have less stat losses when stolen.MaxSterling wrote:You're thinking of one scenario. What about the lone wolf player that gets planet stripped by an alliance of snipers?BMMJ13 wrote:I don't feel you should reward failure (allowing your planet to be stolen) with something more to mass than already there.
With planets, you aren't allowed to do anything for the 4(maybe 3) hours after stealing it, as it's towing the planet, however since it is closer it does not take as long to be back in use. I'm pretty sure most people build up their MS anyway if hitting a planet, unless they are taking a 0 defense planet, and then why reward someone for having a defenseless planet with something to mass?[/quote]MaxSterling wrote:When you send a MS out to find a planet, it's not the fleets that are gone... it's the entire MS. Therefore I'm guessing that the MS is responsible for towing the planet, while the fleets are strictly used to engage the defenses.BMMJ13 wrote:-Full MS doesn't seem like that big of a deal, but it's not really related to the Planet.
MaxSterling wrote:I thought it was only 3 hours, but my reasoning for extending this was because a planet is not in your control and cannot be protected for 12 hours, therefore the MS should need to tow the planet the full distance. Not be sent out to find another planet when the stolen planet isn't even in your control yet.BMMJ13 wrote:-MS can not be sent out for 4 hours I believe already? That's more than enough time for an active enough alliance to mass the persons fleets or MS already.
A compromise could be that en route to bringing your freshly stolen planet back to your territory, the fleets act as temporary planet defense.
The reason for 12 hours is so that the person can take the planet back, not so that the person can be hit. Once again, I don't understand why you are trying to help those who lose planets at the expense of those who take them. That is like allowing anyone who you farm to mass your strike in the next 12 hours, which really doesn't make sense in the current game sense.[/quote]MaxSterling wrote:If a planet can't be protected until 12 hours has passed, then PPT shouldn't be permitted to be set. This was to stop everyone from hit and run without a chance at retaliation. Imagine having 5 planets stripped and all planets dumped with nothing to retaliate against.BMMJ13 wrote:-PPT cannot be sent? So basically you have to choose whether to set PPT or steal a planet for the next day.
MaxSterling wrote:BMMJ13 wrote:Decently defended planets already take multiple turns, where you could lose your fleets to another Mothership, a Player being online and moving platforms onto the planet or even merlining the planet, yet you want to make it riskier for those stealing the planets? I'm pretty sure it already is risky and expensive to mass planets, and with all the other Planet updates it makes even less sense.
You got your 15% back for planet defense : fleet power ratio. You're also only considering one scenario. What if one of those resource accounts with 10 - 200k UP planets gets planet stripped? Would you rather they quit or have a chance at getting 2 of them back and retaliate?
Forum wrote:for planet theft/retaliaation/etc i would like to stick to what we have now for launch, and yes, we can look at other factors surrounding planet stealing at 'pulsecheck' whether this be inability to sell fleets for xx hours, take 2 planet back in 24hours, etc etc
and for messages, a 'type' flag should not be impossible
as for 'too complex' and needing a single place for instruction/rules/how to... ya - i guess its about time the help guide was rewritten
Wepwaet wrote:Edit: @ Forum
Are platforms and planet defenses supposed to work how they do now, independently or were the platforms supposed to enhance the planet defense?
Wepwaet wrote:BMMJ13 wrote:[spoiler][/spoiler]Forum wrote:i like em too, but not going to make this release.
not to say cannot be added if deemed required up the road slightly...MaxSterling wrote:Planet theft current issues :
- Target can be stripped of all planets
- Target can only get back 1 of his planets
- Attacker usually has nothing of value to mass back
Possible solutions :- Target can be stripped of all planets
- Target can only get back 1 of his planets
- Maximum 5 planets lost/day
- Make recovering planets only take 8 hours before they can take another planet. This allows an attacker to recover at least 2 planets before the protection kicks in... IF he notices quick enough.( It takes 12 hours before an attacker can protect the planet )- Attacker usually has nothing of value to mass back
- Attacker must fully arm all slots on MS (*excluding fleets. Only Volleys and Shields [Thx SS])
- Fleets cannot be sold off before the 12 hours it takes for the planet to be under the attackers control.
- MS cannot be sent away for 24 hours from the time the planet was taken. ( Make it the equivalent of sending the MS out for a planet )
- PPT cannot be set for 12 hours after a planet theft to give the target a chance at retaliation.
Players please poke holes in these ideas.
I don't feel you should reward failure (allowing your planet to be stolen) with something more to mass than already there.
-Fleets can be sold now right after attacking, meaning you only get to use the fleets on that planet or
-Full MS doesn't seem like that big of a deal, but it's not really related to the Planet. If a planet has a big defense, then you need to arm the fleets, they in and of themself are something to mass.
-MS can not be sent out for 4 hours I believe already? That's more than enough time for an active enough alliance to mass the persons fleets or MS already.
-PPT cannot be sent? So basically you have to choose whether to set PPT or steal a planet for the next day.
Decently defended planets already take multiple turns, where you could lose your fleets to another Mothership, a Player being online and moving platforms onto the planet or even merlining the planet, yet you want to make it riskier for those stealing the planets? I'm pretty sure it already is risky and expensive to mass planets, and with all the other Planet updates it makes even less sense.
Tell me BMMJ13, where is the risk if you can sell your fleets right after taking a planet? If anything you shouldn't be allowed to sell them off during that 4 hour window so that there IS something to retaliate against.
@ Forum
Could you include fleets not being sellable during that 4 hour period? A person should be able to strike back at what hurt them afterall.
Also if not in this group of updates could you consider the splitting of different types of messages in a future update(maybe when you re-evaluate the new updates). Peace/war settings, alliance messages, regular messages, market messages, etc...
Wepwaet wrote:I equate being able to sell off your fleets right after taking a planet with massing someone while you only have a strike built. They have nothing to retaliate against. Why shouldn't Forum give us a way to fight back as he's doing with those building only strikes?
Wepwaet wrote:I equate being able to sell off your fleets right after taking a planet with massing someone while you only have a strike built. They have nothing to retaliate against. Why shouldn't Forum give us a way to fight back as he's doing with those building only strikes?
Wepwaet wrote:Edit: @ Forum
Are platforms and planet defenses supposed to work how they do now, independently or were the platforms supposed to enhance the planet defense?
Forum wrote:i dont quite understand the QWepwaet wrote:Edit: @ Forum
Are platforms and planet defenses supposed to work how they do now, independently or were the platforms supposed to enhance the planet defense?