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Still making some elementary mistakes about addiction I see Sandman, let me ask you have you ever picked up a medical textbook? Either about psychology or the pyshical body??

The worst statement in your last reply was

Marijuana can get you high off one puff

There just arent the words or terms to describe how inaccurate and outright false that is, seriously peddle your lies and misinformation elsewhere the rest of the grownups would like to talk without your interuptions

a huge number of people smoke weed, in the uk at least. say if something you liked to do was a minority activity that annoyed others. would it be right to deny you your personal freedom to do as you wish (as long as it doesnt measurably affect others). of course not.
i dont think you realise how widespread cannabis use is in the uk (the usa and other developed countries as well)

cigarettes are physically and mentally addictive. they are more dangerous in my opinion.
stoners are mostly a danger to themselves, not others. the vast majority of people who smoke weed chill out afterwards. they rarely go on a rampage. compare that to the actions of those under influence of alcohol. . .
and yes pot heads can be unpredictable, but they are often lazy.

you dont get suddenly high of one puff. maybe you do (*cough lightweight cough)* but most dont.
who drinks one drink? heard of binge drinking? thats way more destructive in way more ways than weed.
i dont speed smoke 10 spliffs in a minute where as shots are popular and the norm for many.
you drink for pleasure? say you have 4 beers at a barbeque. you will feel an effect. and if i smoke a zoot with some pals for pleasure, ill feel an effect.

i can say with certainty that hardcore criminals often deal and smoke weed in the uk. they make lots of money and get high for free.

agrees with Agapooka and kit-fox

Mister Sandman wrote:Seening as the minority wants the legalisation of weed....
again, no to legalisation.

a lack of education and allot of propaganda has everything to do with that

Mister Sandman wrote:Why encourage irresponsible behaviour?

who is "encouraging irresponsible behaviour"?

Mister Sandman wrote:The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Meaning, there is only a minority of people wanting the legalising Marijuana. [this thread cannot be used as a estimation, for various of obvious reasons]

nobody's needs should be neglected regardless of numbers (i use this as an example, so i don't want anyone getting all worked up now), the founding fathers of America understood that no government or body has the right to trample on anyone's freedoms or rights which is why the war of independence was fought, and why they set up a republic instead of a democracy.

Mister Sandman wrote:In addition,
People seem to forget, Marijuana gets you high. No matter how you spin this.

well, what would be the point of smoking it if it doesn't get you high? sky divers and thrill seekers alike do what they do for the adrenalin rush and subsequent "high"...should they be outcast?

Mister Sandman wrote:Lets look at cigarettes in comparison with Marijuana . People who smoke cigarettes, are not high,

WRONG, i've smoked weed in the past and i am a cigarette smoker, and i can tell you that when someone takes their 1st puff on a cigarette, it gives you MUCH more of a buzz (as well as making you feel sick) than your 1st puff on a joint.

Mister Sandman wrote:and thus, not a hazard to safety to themselves, and others. Where as, a person on Marijuana, such with someone being drunk, can be unpredictable, and can be a safety issue.

what if someone has a heart attack while driving on a busy road in the middle of the day with passengers on board and pedestrians and other cars all over the place-because of a 30 year smoking habit...are they only a danger to themselves???



the vast majority of people who smoke Marijuana, do so for pleasure and relaxation. unlike alcohol, it doesn't totally change ones personality, i have friends who used to smoke weed and we would all chill out together, but same friends when drunk would become anti-social to the point they were not the same people.



most of your replies are stemming from a lack of real world experience. i suggest you study and get some first hand experience before making such absolute statements.

rely more on first hand knowledge/experience when making your posts, rather than the conclusions you have drawn from debatable sources (IE, the establishment) and religious zealousy.





*awaits Sandmans reply which will not consist of debating the facts i have posted, but instead will ignore them and post some more rubbish*

One of the reasons marijuana has an effect on the mind and body of an individual smoking it is that it affects dopamine levels. Heck, sex releases dopamine. Guess that's why sex is bad for you. Your parents are sinners!!!! ;p

You also forget about seritonin.


Tea and coffee also give you a dopemegenic activation, your point? These things induce a reaction that is natural, how is this natural. Its like saying go in a fire it will get you high, its the smoke killing you that but I guess its the painful alternative popping brain cells what a buzz?

Intoxication is the state of being affected by one or more psychoactive drugs. It can also refer to the effects caused by the ingestion of poison or by the overconsumption of normally harmless substances.

How about illusory or euphoric better term, I just dont see how you can state smoking which is not "natural" to the body is good for you its like sucking up smoke where is the difference and can you prove it and to what I say is credible?

Some types of intoxication:
A mechanism of disease.
Drunkenness (alcohol intoxication)
Caffeine intoxication
Cannabis intoxication
Contact high

Heroin intoxication[/quote]

Water intoxication

That's a new one but there is getting off on oxygen or the high concentration.

a lack of education and allot of propaganda has everything to do with that

Lack of education? Propaganda? I tell ya like I said before there is credible prof out there that states there is a danger as for propaganda I don't see anything to hold up that case. I would be the first in this debate to say well if it helps people then use it.

Mister Sandman wrote:
Why encourage irresponsible behaviour?


who is "encouraging irresponsible behaviour"?

I agree I don't see how it would necessarily change behaviour.

GhostyGoo wrote:Apologies but i'm not reading through 11 pages.

Can anyone please tell me why "cannabis" should be legalised? I'm quite sure that anyone who studies chemistry or shamanism can see my point...my point being, the essential need for "cannabis" in society is what?

Your whole debate seems, like most do on this topic, to have strayed from the subject of marijuana.

Do correct me, if i'm mistaken.

-Goo™

From what i understand mate the debacle is the legality, health consequences and but you raise a great point

"my point being, the essential need for "cannabis" in society is what?"

From what I understand the main points for are pure cannabis has little or not side affect on the body, it would reduce crime and its a conspiracy, please guys tell me if I am wrong. But I would recommend those 11 pages have been intense


One more thing

most of your replies are stemming from a lack of real world experience. i suggest you study and get some first hand experience before making such absolute statements.

rely more on first hand knowledge/experience when making your posts, rather than the conclusions you have drawn from debatable sources (IE, the establishment) and religious zealousy.

I am speaking from seeing real world experience go to an NA meeting and then say that Marijuana is good for ya. I could not think of anybody more experienced.

Also so you know Mister Sandman I never use a religious point of view its too objective to really use against a legal issue, law is very difficult to say right and wrong from a religious point of view. But stay determined.

why would i need to go to an NA meeting when i have lived it and also seen others smoke the stuff with me?

granted 5 or 6 joints doesn't constitute a whole lot of experience in some peoples eyes, but i know plenty of people who have been smoking it for 10, 20, 30 and 40,+ years and i can see with my own eyes that much of the naysayers objections are unfounded and based on the lies and propaganda coming from the TV and politicians...hence my use of the word propaganda.

lone dragon wrote:

One of the reasons marijuana has an effect on the mind and body of an individual smoking it is that it affects dopamine levels. Heck, sex releases dopamine. Guess that's why sex is bad for you. Your parents are sinners!!!! ;p

You also forget about seritonin.


Tea and coffee also give you a dopemegenic activation, your point? These things induce a reaction that is natural, how is this natural. Its like saying go in a fire it will get you high, its the smoke killing you that but I guess its the painful alternative popping brain cells what a buzz?

"Currently, there are three general types of cannabinoids: phytocannabinoids occur uniquely in the cannabis plant; endogenous cannabinoids are produced in the bodies of humans and other animals; and synthetic cannabinoids are similar compounds produced in a laboratory."

That's directly off wiki and while wiki is somewhat of a questionable reference if you google you can easily find a more credible source that states the same thing.

Cannaboids are produced by the human body. Somewhat of of a natural reaction you could say.

lone dragon wrote:

Intoxication is the state of being affected by one or more psychoactive drugs. It can also refer to the effects caused by the ingestion of poison or by the overconsumption of normally harmless substances.

How about illusory or euphoric better term, I just dont see how you can state smoking which is not "natural" to the body is good for you its like sucking up smoke where is the difference and can you prove it and to what I say is credible?

Regardless of the sensations involved I agree with you 100% that inhaling smoke has a negative effect on the lungs. Easily, nobody should doubt or question that. However, there are alternate methods to using marijuana. You can use vaporizers (you inhale THC vapors) which doesn't have the same negative impact on your lungs that direct smoke does. There are pills you can take, edibles that get you high. You can get THC shots, they even have oils and lotions that you can rub on your skin. There are many alternatives to plainly smoking marijuana.

lone dragon wrote:I am speaking from seeing real world experience go to an NA meeting and then say that Marijuana is good for ya. I could not think of anybody more experienced.

While I for one consider myself very experienced, posts made in this thread suggest that reactions or experiences in terms of personal use or seeing people you know use it is relative to the people and places in which these events occur. If it is relative based on surroundings and the people using, is it really conclusive then to blame weed for changes in people? I mean, people change naturally as they grow.

I was going to point out that smoke isn't the only medium available to those wishing to get high off THC, but Alex beat me to it.

Furthermore, why would coffee and tea be more natural than marijuana, Lone Dragon? Aren't all three psychoactive drugs from plants?

Agapooka

Alex wrote:Regardless of the sensations involved I agree with you 100% that inhaling smoke has a negative effect on the lungs. Easily, nobody should doubt or question that. However, there are alternate methods to using marijuana. You can use vaporizers (you inhale THC vapors) which doesn't have the same negative impact on your lungs that direct smoke does. There are pills you can take, edibles that get you high. You can get THC shots, they even have oils and lotions that you can rub on your skin. There are many alternatives to plainly smoking marijuana.

YEEEEESSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "However, there are alternate methods to using marijuana. You can use vaporizers (you inhale THC vapors) which doesn't have the same negative impact on your lungs that direct smoke does. There are pills you can take, edibles that get you high. You can get THC shots, they even have oils and lotions that you can rub on your skin. There are many alternatives to plainly smoking marijuana."[/color], best idea so far, finally I can agree on something, using this to calm people and help people with dementia would be of great use but not smoking.
Great point Alex

Agapooka wrote:I was going to point out that smoke isn't the only medium available to those wishing to get high off THC, but Alex beat me to it.

Furthermore, why would coffee and tea be more natural than marijuana, Lone Dragon? Aren't all three psychoactive drugs from plants?

Agapooka

Thus far you don't get a high like you can from marijuana,unless you can prove me wrong, tea well never heard of someone coming up and say I got a high on tea. There is the coffee rush but never heard of anyone saying they had a trip on caffeine

You can with careful attention using tea leaves / coffee beans create a beverage that is just as hallucinogenic as natually occuring THC. It is perfectly possilbe to get high off both tea and coffee.

Most people dont filter/concentrate the mixtures they make enough however to lead to these effects and very few would believe it possible even if you told them.

Kit-Fox wrote:You can with careful attention using tea leaves / coffee beans create a beverage that is just as hallucinogenic as natually occuring THC. It is perfectly possilbe to get high off both tea and coffee.

Most people dont filter/concentrate the mixtures they make enough however to lead to these effects and very few would believe it possible even if you told them.

Really, so you can smoke it??? How would that work for coffee? man it would leave a bad taste in ya mouth.
Could it be used in a peace pipe?

Please note the use of the word beverage, which indicates a drink.

If you are trying to indicate that smoking weed is more harmful, you might consider that drinking too much strong coffee such as proper turkish coffee can give you stomach ulcers. So you see such drinks are just as bad for you as smoking weed can be.

Mister Sandman wrote:Will reply to all your ill-conceived arguments soon

For now, camping.

lmao


all i can say to everyone's post is...god forbid (no, i haven't suddenly turned religious) we might do something for the sake of pleasure simply because the naysayers don't approve!

at the end of the day, and unless i missed the day we suddenly went from a free society (whatever the hell that means these days?!) to a dictatorship?! if i choose to smoke weed, NOBODY on this planet has ANY right to deny me so long as i harm nobody else...

i'd like to see someone argue against that!



i'm sure there are enough naysayers who would deny me my basic human rights, to you i say...Heil Hitler

Mister Sandman wrote:Will reply to all your ill-conceived arguments soon

For now, camping.

I'm starting to think that you are really a closet pot head and that your just doing all this because you think its funny.

[KMA]Avenger wrote:

Mister Sandman wrote:Will reply to all your ill-conceived arguments soon

For now, camping.

lmao


all i can say to everyone's post is...god forbid (no, i haven't suddenly turned religious) we might do something for the sake of pleasure simply because the naysayers don't approve!

at the end of the day, and unless i missed the day we suddenly went from a free society (whatever the hell that means these days?!) to a dictatorship?! if i choose to smoke weed, NOBODY on this planet has ANY right to deny me so long as i harm nobody else...

i'd like to see someone argue against that!



i'm sure there are enough naysayers who would deny me my basic human rights, to you i say...Heil Hitler

Good point except what is up with this forum and all the nazi and hitler references. they make me . They also make your argument very easy to dismiss because you've come out and made outlandish statements like that. Human beings are just complex animals and want to control everything they like and dislike, its just human nature and all depends on what can be made acceptable to the general public. Hitler hated jews and managed to convince the german army and public that the jews and other minorities were subhuman so as to make it bearable for the soldiers to massacre all those innocent people.
The war on drugs is a war on peoples liberties. Its not too bad in ireland but it has grown to epic proportions in america.

Alex wrote:

Mister Sandman wrote:Will reply to all your ill-conceived arguments soon

For now, camping.

I'm starting to think that you are really a closet pot head and that your just doing all this because you think its funny.

I would absolutely love if this was true