StarGateWars Forums

General Disorder wrote:Well ok I noticed allot of comments on how these updates are supposed to close the gap. Yet for new players trying to get into the game selling at weps back at 10% is a bit harsh to them I believe.

Since coming back and starting a new account from scratch I have to ascend and grow both as quickly as possible. To do so I have to have an offense. Yet in order to grow as fast as possible I need to do my own raiding and doing so with a high offense is costly in naq, so I have to sell my weps because after ascending I need to buy a strike right away to get into G&R range and then buy it back again right after.

So now with these new prices on strike weps it's gonna cost a fair bit of naq to sell them. While it's bad enough the players market has raised at prices 10times since last I played and new players are hard pressed to afford them and it's nice we can get more from mts which we have yet to see how players market will be effected by that. I wish the attack weps would stay the same after all it's always seemed more people get annoyed when people sell their def and not their att in wars.

brainwave for meh

if you have ascended in the last month you get a higher resale of attack wpes (still slighlty abusable by warring ascenders, but a major ifx and encouragement to ascend even?)

Join me wrote:Gives lots of room to double your ship/planets even further, and get more bonus/boost from it than if you had a 1 trill ship/planets with less than 2 trill attack/def power...

I think this update in power is thinking big picture long term, when peoples ships are a lot bigger and planets a lot stronger as average account size/and incomes grow every day.

Not bad overall,,, would like to learn more about alliance bank spending and lone wolf to make a decision which way to go.

stuff of legends wrote:it doesnt give room. It just means that $$ spenders get screwed over with their ms which is hilariously funny.
As for it not giving it room, It gets more expensive as you buy more. So the high end ms's are barely buying 1k slots for 10 trill or absurd amounts of naq.
It levels the battlefield however for gigantic ms's and newish (emphasize the ish to include players that already have a 100-200 mill army and such) players that rely mostly on their attack and not hold a 1 trilll attack backed by 500 bill in planet power and a further 1 trill in ms power that have an extremely small amount of losses compared to the newish's.
Its a good thought, it will kill the $$ market, which $$ is kinda an unfair advantage in this game anyway. However some have honestly worked hard at getting to where they are.
Maybe Jason is just reminding us of his godly powers....
So instead of 2x maybe 1.5x or some other one?

Exactly that's the answer. However you're forgetting that not everyone put $$ into MS and planets so those of us that haven't are screwed big time.
This update just encourages people to not do basically anything (240AT before nox is removed limit, 2x def & strike which decrease the value of MS and planets, etc) and they will still have a fighting chance for top..

~N

What are the alliances able to buy with their alliance bank?
how does the extra bank size ppt time etc,,, work?
does it stay within the alliance? or does it stay with the players that were in the alliance when it was purchased?

Earendil wrote:So, again, we should disregard the hard work of many to make it easier for others?

How is it disregarding the hard work of many? Doesn't everyone get the same power from the update? It's not like "Hey, you've spend resources on this, so, were gonna nerf it", all though it's happened before.

Sarevok wrote:

Earendil wrote:So, again, we should disregard the hard work of many to make it easier for others?

How is it disregarding the hard work of many? Doesn't everyone get the same power from the update? It's not like "Hey, you've spend resources on this, so, were gonna nerf it", all though it's happened before.

Difference is that those of us who invested 100s of trillions of naq, heck even more than 1QT naq into our MS to gain an advantage now have almost no advantage against those who spent like 100T on their MS. Massing MS itself isn't a problem and it isn't why we invested so much naq into our MSs, it's massing defs that we wanted to make a lot cheaper and for opponents to mass our def that we wanted to make more expensive and that is completely ruined with the new updates..

~N

Join me wrote:Gives lots of room to double your ship/planets even further, and get more bonus/boost from it than if you had a 1 trill ship/planets with less than 2 trill attack/def power...

I think this update in power is thinking big picture long term, when peoples ships are a lot bigger and planets a lot stronger as average account size/and incomes grow every day.

Not bad overall,,, would like to learn more about alliance bank spending and lone wolf to make a decision which way to go.

Ok... sometimes I think we have some of the biggest idiots in this game. Some people really need to think about the "big picture" before they say anything.

Before the update :
3m attack supers - all armed
3m attack mercs - 1m armed
SUBTOTAL = 900b strike
400b attack planet bonus
TOTAL = roughly 1.3T strike

After the update :
2m attack supers - all armed
2m attack mercs - 1m armed
SUBTOTAL = 900b strike
400b attack planet bonus
TOTAL = roughly 1.3T strike

Now I only need half as many trained and armed soldiers to get full use of my
MS and planets. Perfect example of how updates aren't completely thought out.

At least before, I didn't get my full MS bonus on my defense because I maintained
about a 800b defense. Now that it's doubled, I now get full MS support.

damaged weapons are stronger than fixed ones ????

Exactly that's the answer. However you're forgetting that not everyone put $$ into MS and planets so those of us that haven't are screwed big time.

3rd last line on my post neim

Neimenljivi wrote:Difference is that those of us who invested 100s of trillions of naq, heck even more than 1QT naq into our MS to gain an advantage now have almost no advantage against those who spent like 100T on their MS. Massing MS itself isn't a problem and it isn't why we invested so much naq into our MSs, it's massing defs that we wanted to make a lot cheaper and for opponents to mass our def that we wanted to make more expensive and that is completely ruined with the new updates..

~N

If massing a MS isn't a problem, then it's bonus to your defence isn't that much of a hindrance to your opponent when you are being massed.

And like Max said, now you don't need as many units to fully utilise its power.

Or am I missing something

Sarevok wrote:

Neimenljivi wrote:Difference is that those of us who invested 100s of trillions of naq, heck even more than 1QT naq into our MS to gain an advantage now have almost no advantage against those who spent like 100T on their MS. Massing MS itself isn't a problem and it isn't why we invested so much naq into our MSs, it's massing defs that we wanted to make a lot cheaper and for opponents to mass our def that we wanted to make more expensive and that is completely ruined with the new updates..

~N

If massing a MS isn't a problem, then it's bonus to your defence isn't that much of a hindrance to your opponent when you are being massed.

And like Max said, now you don't need as many units to fully utilise its power.

Or am I missing something

Let's say biggest Mothership Strike in game is 1.2 tril.

If you have 1.2 tril mothership strike now, doubling a 1.2 normal strike, you are able to get 2.4 tril total with 3 mil supers and weapons, compared to 6 mil supers and weapons for someone without the mothership

Before, if you had the 1.2 and 1.2, you are able to get 2.4 tril total with 6 mil supers and weapons, compared to 12 mil supers and weapons for someone without the mothership.

So basically, their bonus is less effective as someone needs half as many units to counter it. I think this idea makes sense, as you need more than just motherships and planets to mass at a lower level than before, though I also have not invested a lot into either. It certainly doesn't completely ruin the idea of either though, as some may be claiming, just means it's not a cover all for everything.

BMMJ13 wrote:Let's say biggest Mothership Strike in game is 1.2 tril.

If you have 1.2 tril mothership strike now, doubling a 1.2 normal strike, you are able to get 2.4 tril total with 3 mil supers and weapons, compared to 6 mil supers and weapons for someone without the mothership

Before, if you had the 1.2 and 1.2, you are able to get 2.4 tril total with 6 mil supers and weapons, compared to 12 mil supers and weapons for someone without the mothership.

So basically, their bonus is less effective as someone needs half as many units to counter it. I think this idea makes sense, as you need more than just motherships and planets to mass at a lower level than before, though I also have not invested a lot into either. It certainly doesn't completely ruin the idea of either though, as some may be claiming, just means it's not a cover all for everything.

Look at the costs for getting a 1.3t strike on a MS. It costs 1.25quad to get that and as you pointed out its only effective up until a 7.5t def(pre change). Just think about that ,the top MS's couldn't make taking down the highest defenses fully efficient before the changes were put in place. People say "well you only need half the troops to have the same effectiveness as before" but with the updates came a massive buildup of defenses on top of the already doubling of the already existing ones. People being people didn't build less, they built more. The cost to double that top MS strike and bring it back on par with how it was before... 3.75quad (over half of what the most extreme of farmers have farmed... EVER). Planets are not quite as bad needing a mere couple houndred tril to a quad to become relavant again.

I wonder how people would feel if fleets were suddenly half their current power, or UP planets suddenly only gave 25% of the natural UP, or lifers and miners produced only half income...

The bottom line is that the changes to how a defense holds up has encouraged people to build up. Even undoubled, most of the defenses are past the previous point where MS's and planets gave people a percieved "free ride".




Why oh why is hard work being penalized?

Sarevok wrote:

Neimenljivi wrote:Difference is that those of us who invested 100s of trillions of naq, heck even more than 1QT naq into our MS to gain an advantage now have almost no advantage against those who spent like 100T on their MS. Massing MS itself isn't a problem and it isn't why we invested so much naq into our MSs, it's massing defs that we wanted to make a lot cheaper and for opponents to mass our def that we wanted to make more expensive and that is completely ruined with the new updates..

~N

If massing a MS isn't a problem, then it's bonus to your defence isn't that much of a hindrance to your opponent when you are being massed.

And like Max said, now you don't need as many units to fully utilise its power.

Or am I missing something

If we were talking about only strike being doubled, I'd agree with you that it wouldn't change much - heck it'd make it easier. However, let's take into account 2T def before the updates with a 1T MS strike and ground strike. Before the updates you needed 3m supers + 3m mercs and that was it. You fully used the potential of your MS with a fully balanced account. Now ALL these defenses doubled to 4T, true you now get 2T strike with same amount of supers and mercs, but you need another 1,5m supers and mercs with 1T addon from MS to inflict the same damage and beat the defense. So you need 1,5m supers and 1,5m mercs MORE with everything else the same (and of course that also means 3m weps more which means bigger repairs) to successfully attack a defense which was doubled but noone needed more supers for it.
That's if we don't take in account defense weps lasting longer etc etc. The only time this helps you use the full potential of your MS, mind I say in peace times to farm you usually had strike big enough to use it, now you just have to build even bigger attack, is times of big wars and that's because the defenses are smaller then so in term strikes don't have to be so big either. But instead of MS doubling your 200b def or 400b strike, it'll now be your MS doubling 400b def and if it's big enough your 800b strike.

Also about MS - while it holds it does add a lot more, but you only yellowed one part. It's also that we wanted to make massing defs cheaper for us (1/2 of the opponent's def = ground strike, MS compensates for the other 1/2) and that was the main reason, making it more expensive for our enemies to mass us is just a bonus..

~N

Well i see what people are complaining about, admin you have just screwed up the attacking/defending now, it took me 1.5k AT's to mass a mere *before updates* 100 bill defence. Also i have lost 55 bill on my ME...
It would probably be worth looking into being able to get more turns somehow, that could balance it out; i mean you have extended the massing to make it more timely and slightly more costly without going overboard but i sure as hell am not going to mass a 200 bill defence with a 2 trill attack and it costing me 1.5k turns to take it.

I don't like the cost either, but....
*mentions the request that people can't mass entire alliances on their own a while back, which got signed/repeated by a lot of people*

Theres a difference between massing alliances and massing one person with a crap defence