London/UK Riots 2011

[Kit-Fox]

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[minisaiyan]

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

@KF. randomly killing i dont think i mentioned. I said water cannons, and if neccessary plastic bulets, they will hurt, but risk of killing is unlikely. And the insurance pays for the damages, then who pays for the insurance next year as the price skyrockets.

Also, I know someone from the Durham police force who has just left to go to London. I know his two kids of ages 10 and 6. If employing a water cannon is going to make his job safer, then I will go down there and fire it myself.

[[KMA]Avenger]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUzuYoCk ... r_embedded

Those girls couldn't construct a coherent statement if i put a gun to their head...and i have ZERO education to my name!

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

You are kidding right?!

I assume you are because that statement is absolutely shocking on every level to say the least

[Kit-Fox]

Removed

[Cole]

The idea that these rioters form any kind of "rebel" element in English society is patently absurd. Drunk, opportunistic and angry kids stealing a plasma TV from Comet is a far cry from the protests in Libya or Syria or Egypt.

True. The 'rebels' in Libya are also murderous swines. I do agree. English society is ripe for an actual rebellion though. Since the West loves interfering in internal affairs (like Libya, Syria, Egypt, Yemen), why do they not interfere in England today? You cannot possibly say that these thieving, vandalising mobs are being handled properly..

As I said earlier to few other people, let's not compare what's not comparable...

I don't think (well actually I do *know* it's not possible to) Cameron/UK's politics can be compared with Khadafi, Saleh, Ben Ali or Mubarak.

Well, rebels in Libya are more of tribal rebellion. But if you replace a bad guy by a bad bunch, it's still not same as UK's case. As for bad handleing, it's probably due to what Kit fox said, the 80s outcome of past riots...which leads me to think, who actually would feel sympathy/pity for these rioting thugs of today & blame the police?

[minisaiyan]

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

You are kidding right?!

I assume you are because that statement is absolutely shocking on every level to say the least

Of course I was joking, every **Filtered** should go and stand on a pavement by shops being burnt and just watch the thugs doing as they please. Brilliant idea.

[[KMA]Avenger]

And what happens if as KF pointed out-innocent people get shot by rubber bullets or water cannon and end up hurt or worse?

There is no easy solution to this and to say that letting the police come in with such a heavy hand is what's needed is a simplistic approach to a VERY volatile situation which could easily make matters MUCH worse.
Having said that, that's not to say the police should stand back, watch and wait for things to calm down before acting.

Guilty by association?
Why would 'innocent' bystanders be in the thick of the riots anyways.

It's not unheard of and has been known to happen.

Edit:

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

You are kidding right?!

I assume you are because that statement is absolutely shocking on every level to say the least

Of course I was joking, every **Filtered** should go and stand on a pavement by shops being burnt and just watch the thugs doing as they please. Brilliant idea.

You are obviously not talking to me since i have not advocated the police stand back and watch....unless you can show me where i said that exactly?

[minisaiyan]

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

You are kidding right?!

I assume you are because that statement is absolutely shocking on every level to say the least

Of course I was joking, every **Filtered** should go and stand on a pavement by shops being burnt and just watch the thugs doing as they please. Brilliant idea.

You are obviously not talking to me since i have not advocated the police stand back and watch....unless you can show me where i said that exactly?

the police are part of the people that are willing to take the risk to defend their country. My post refered to citizens that ought to not be in the streets while riots are taking place.

[[KMA]Avenger]

@KMA, innocent people that arent ready to take a risk to defend their country should not be out in the steerts when riots are happening.

You are kidding right?!

I assume you are because that statement is absolutely shocking on every level to say the least

Of course I was joking, every **Filtered** should go and stand on a pavement by shops being burnt and just watch the thugs doing as they please. Brilliant idea.

You are obviously not talking to me since i have not advocated the police stand back and watch....unless you can show me where i said that exactly?

the police are part of the people that are willing to take the risk to defend their country. My post refered to citizens that ought to not be in the streets while riots are taking place.

Agreed, but as i said to Eärendil...

[Kit-Fox]

Removed

[Field Marshall]

Please oh so very please do go to NI or even Eire and publically state that rubber bullets dont kill people.

I'd love to see if you make it out of there alive, hell even a 'blank' can kill.

And water cannons again can also seriously injure/miam & cause permanent disability & they are not target specific weapons, they are indiscrimate which is even worse than so called 'rubber' bullets.

EDIT: As for your police friend, well thats his job. To put his life on the line to defend society. He is paid to do exactly that & if required to even die in the line of duty. If he cant stomach that or doesnt like the prospect then perhaps he shouldnt be a cop.

You're a A1 idiot no offence intended of course...

If you think police sign up to put their life on the line, you are completely and utterly incorrect. The basic principle of the force is to reduce and eliminate crime as safely as practically possible. If this is made safer by means of water cannons and deterents, then so be it. That's why the use of them have now been authorised.

Nevertheless, there is inherent danger with the job in hand, do not insult the honor of this man, he is infact attending and I am sure he does so with pride. This man is a father of 2 and deserves a little respect.

In Northern Ireland over 35 years (1970–2005) approximately 125,000 baton rounds were fired—an average of ten per day—causing 17 deaths.[11] The baton round was made available to British police forces outside Northern Ireland from 2001.

Yes there is a risk, but work out 17 from 125,000. I am sure more people have been killed by a riot shield to the head or by mob rule.

So the chances of somebody making it "out alive" is significantly high.

[Kit-Fox]

Removed

[Field Marshall]

The job of the police is to bring law breakers to the courts & to defend society if called upon to do so (which they are called upon to do so when civil unrest/riots happen)

Part of that includes putting thier lives at risk so that other members of society dont have.

And yes that is part of the job whether you like it or not.

Being a police officer is not a job or a career, it is a calling & having had several family members in various police forces in the UK who have told me that & would tell you that too I can safely say it is a fair description.

If members of the police forces today cant stomach that, then perhaps they are in the *wrong* profession

Part of their job means that they should be able to carry out their day to day operations without the risk of death.

Like I say, with any job or proffesion, it is about risk analysis and controlling those risks as much as reasonably practical.

You don't send a soldier to war without protection or a gun. Why send an officer to the front line without protection.

It may be a calling, it is not a calling to death however.

[[KMA]Avenger]

And what happens if as KF pointed out-innocent people get shot by rubber bullets or water cannon and end up hurt or worse?

There is no easy solution to this and to say that letting the police come in with such a heavy hand is what's needed is a simplistic approach to a VERY volatile situation which could easily make matters MUCH worse.
Having said that, that's not to say the police should stand back, watch and wait for things to calm down before acting.

Guilty by association?
Why would 'innocent' bystanders be in the thick of the riots anyways.

It's not unheard of and has been known to happen.

Sure its known to happen but I bet that they could also be opportunistic as well.
innocent until proven guilty? To me, those with/ the rioting groups are proving guilt.

Unless someone is actively engaged in rioting/looting then to label them as guilty by association is wrong period...

What if you go out with a couple friends or even family members, and as you are walking down the street a riot or looting spree occurs right in front of you and your friends get involved. you STRONGLY disagree with what they are doing but because of your friendship the most you can tell them is to stop? what if you tell them to stop and they turn on you? in such a situation would you even say anything to them if you don't agree with their actions and risk being set upon by others getting involved.

Trying to cover all the possible scenarios in these situations is not easy to say the least, so best to just say, It's been known to happen.

[Juliette]

Who is the toff standing to one side? Made me lol

Tagline: "Dear me old chap, those jeans would look positively terrible on you"

There are a load of pictures online where you can give great taglines. This being one of them.