StarGateWars Forums

Auriel wrote::?


But what is currently the big problem with this then!?
I'm beginning to think I'm missing the whole problem.

the big problem with this update is that it really limits smaller player's ability to ascend. this keeps the smaller players stuck at the bottom of the barrel no matter how much they try to catch up.

in case you guys don't remember when you were small...little players don't have trillions in bank size to play with. most of the small guys(those that would actually try to ascend) are lucky to have 50bil in bank size. as we all know its impossible to stock anything substantial in a 50bil bank. and i'm sure that you can figure out what happens to a small player after they ascend and cant afford to replace all of their defense right away(due to lack of stock)...they get farmed.

any other questions with obvious answers auriel?

Naminef wrote:

Auriel wrote::?


But what is currently the big problem with this then!?
I'm beginning to think I'm missing the whole problem.

the big problem with this update is that it really limits smaller player's ability to ascend. this keeps the smaller players stuck at the bottom of the barrel no matter how much they try to catch up.

in case you guys don't remember when you were small...little players don't have trillions in bank size to play with. most of the small guys(those that would actually try to ascend) are lucky to have 50bil in bank size. as we all know its impossible to stock anything substantial in a 50bil bank. and i'm sure that you can figure out what happens to a small player after they ascend and cant afford to replace all of their defense right away(due to lack of stock)...they get farmed.

any other questions with obvious answers auriel?

Naminef I agree with you, this (worst) update will hurt only small players.
I know by my self that I will not ascending any more, because I don't have enough big bank for rebuilding my self

Admin please DELETE, DESTROY this update.

Indeed unlike UP planets which received many whinnings and as much it was a logical update (having 1k raw UP and 10 50k UP planets and you would have 500k UP... ) as much this one is useless and devastating to many many players (over half of active players)!

Jim: Please say something constructive instead of "This is bad". If this isn't the answer, than what should it be?

Naminef wrote:the big problem with this update is that it really limits smaller player's ability to ascend. this keeps the smaller players stuck at the bottom of the barrel no matter how much they try to catch up.

*cough*
I'm a simple prior right now, and I still can't see how an ascension becomes more difficult when your weapons resale value drops. But maybe I'm crazy.

Naminef wrote:in case you guys don't remember when you were small...little players don't have trillions in bank size to play with. most of the small guys(those that would actually try to ascend) are lucky to have 50bil in bank size. as we all know its impossible to stock anything substantial in a 50bil bank. and i'm sure that you can figure out what happens to a small player after they ascend and cant afford to replace all of their defense right away(due to lack of stock)...they get farmed.

Why, of course they get farmed! If that were the problem, I would slap myself on my forehead and cry.
Of course they get farmed when their defs aren't up to speed. Heck, I get farmed when my def is weak. So what do I do? I farm people that are smaller than me.
Now, I wonder.. there's NO one in the game, except for that one dude whose name I forgot, who has NO one who has a smaller armysize. Statistically speaking, there can be only ONE who'd suffer that horrendous fate. Non-statistically speaking, well.. there's a group of people who indeed start playing the game, and never seem to get away from their 1 UP, 0 spy levels, stuff like that.
I remember that, when we first started playing, the game went incredibly slowly to one's feeling. Then we got lucky and hit a dude who happened to have a few mil naq out. Oh, how glad we were!

Seriously.. don't think we don't know how it is to be small. Used to be small myself, yes, years ago.
Oh.. what's that? Yeah.. I think it is unfair and unreasonable that you want to be at the level we're at after playing far less time than we have.
That's the big, old player whine.. and it has merit because of this.
Anyway.. be happy that you're able to grow FAR faster than any of us have when the games began. Every new generation grows faster.. but yeah.. it takes time (alas, more time than skill) to get to the levels we're at.

Naminef wrote:any other questions with obvious answers auriel?

Yup, plenty. But you wouldn't want to hear any of them, as they have little to do with the game.

Auriel wrote:Jim: Please say something constructive instead of "This is bad". If this isn't the answer, than what should it be?

Naminef wrote:the big problem with this update is that it really limits smaller player's ability to ascend. this keeps the smaller players stuck at the bottom of the barrel no matter how much they try to catch up.

*cough*
I'm a simple prior right now, and I still can't see how an ascension becomes more difficult when your weapons resale value drops. But maybe I'm crazy.

Naminef wrote:in case you guys don't remember when you were small...little players don't have trillions in bank size to play with. most of the small guys(those that would actually try to ascend) are lucky to have 50bil in bank size. as we all know its impossible to stock anything substantial in a 50bil bank. and i'm sure that you can figure out what happens to a small player after they ascend and cant afford to replace all of their defense right away(due to lack of stock)...they get farmed.

Why, of course they get farmed! If that were the problem, I would slap myself on my forehead and cry.
Of course they get farmed when their defs aren't up to speed. Heck, I get farmed when my def is weak. So what do I do? I farm people that are smaller than me.
Now, I wonder.. there's NO one in the game, except for that one dude whose name I forgot, who has NO one who has a smaller armysize. Statistically speaking, there can be only ONE who'd suffer that horrendous fate. Non-statistically speaking, well.. there's a group of people who indeed start playing the game, and never seem to get away from their 1 UP, 0 spy levels, stuff like that.
I remember that, when we first started playing, the game went incredibly slowly to one's feeling. Then we got lucky and hit a dude who happened to have a few mil naq out. Oh, how glad we were!

Seriously.. don't think we don't know how it is to be small. Used to be small myself, yes, years ago.
Oh.. what's that? Yeah.. I think it is unfair and unreasonable that you want to be at the level we're at after playing far less time than we have.
That's the big, old player whine.. and it has merit because of this.
Anyway.. be happy that you're able to grow FAR faster than any of us have when the games began. Every new generation grows faster.. but yeah.. it takes time (alas, more time than skill) to get to the levels we're at.

Naminef wrote:any other questions with obvious answers auriel?

Yup, plenty. But you wouldn't want to hear any of them, as they have little to do with the game.

oh don't misread my position as whining about growth. and don't think that i'm complaining because this doesn't directly effect me. its very simple why ascensions became much more difficult after this. weapons cost a nice chunk of naq for a smaller player, at least much more so than they do for a larger player since a larger player would be making MUCH more naq per turn. so when a smaller player sinks that much naq into weapons to be able to get into G+R range they are basically being penalized where those that have already finished ascending were not punished.

a good number of the older players used the over-banking bug(feature, whatever) to do their ascensions in quick order and as such they have no right to complain about anything dealing with ascensions. however, some of the older players actually did it by stocking and brokering away the naq as most people do now. the people that went about ascending this way gain a significant advantage over those that are trying to do it now just do to the resale value of the weapons since they lost only 20% of the weapons that they were stocking rather than the 52% loss that it currently is. so the players that started long ago have a 32% resale advantage on those that are currently ascending.

and you may be happy as a prior but personally i think thats silly. why not take all of the 5% bonuses? the small cost for them is well worth it in units lost during attacks in the end. assuming that your average player will try to ascend to LG+1(which is reasonable) they stand to lose trillions just due to weapons resale that the older players didn't not have to deal with. this is a significant obstacle for players that don't have the bank space to support their stocking.

and as for the farming...
is farming part of the game...sure.
is it something that you can minimize if you control your account properly...yes

the problem is that without being able to properly stock naq for after your ascension, its rather difficult to build a reasonable defense to avoid most farming after you ascend. this is not a result of having too little naq or having too few UU. no it's a result of the weapons resale value since there is nowhere left to store that naq since its impossible to get a bank big enough to store that naq when your army size is lower. so what admin did with this change is to basically make ascending a suicidal act for small players since most of them won't be able to have the naq to defend themselves after ascending and thus they will get farmed senseless...and hence lose more naq and UU to game progression that others players weren't forced to lose in the past.

Naminef wrote:in case you guys don't remember when you were small...little players don't have trillions in bank size to play with. most of the small guys(those that would actually try to ascend) are lucky to have 50bil in bank size. as we all know its impossible to stock anything substantial in a 50bil bank. and i'm sure that you can figure out what happens to a small player after they ascend and cant afford to replace all of their defense right away(due to lack of stock)...they get farmed.

People with 50 bil. bank size shouldn't ascend... wish I knew this back then

Well I just ascended and this set me back about 500B I knew i should have sold them all as soon as i got my points waited a day and lost about half my savings

This will make it impossible for new players to save for higher covert levels as well. They have no chance of getting covert level 24 or 25 without being farmed. Without at least those they have no was of getting into G&R range.

There are plenty other ways to get in G&R range..
Btw, if you don't have sponsors to get you the bit of naq it takes to get to 23 or 24.. Are you playing this game alone?!

For all its worth, it affects everyone.
Ascension has just became more expensive to recover from.

On the other side, I think ascension wasn't realy meant to be used this way in the first place though; the selling of all the weapons to have lots of naq after ascending.

I'm not a fan of this update.

I think it hurts the game more than it helps.

i wish i could have made the chat to voice opposition to this but i don't have the time due to real life commitments.

Ascensions will be a lot more difficult to recover from now.

I'm not really saying anything that hasn't not already been said but i believe this will create a huge gulf between those who have ascended to the level they want vs those who have not.

i personally didn't think the old resale value needed to be changed

All its likely to do is drive up the price of naq on the cash market. which is silly because the owners/coders of the game dont see any of that revenue (better value for cash on the market vs supporter packages, although u do take a risk)

Rising Naquadah prices are a good thing.

After all, everyone produces Naquadah. Rising prices mean that there is effectively 'less' Naq in the streets. A very good thing.


Now.. where was the poll that said "Yay Update! Long live Jay!"?

i personally don't like this update but i think a better way to do this would be a tiered system,the unascended have the original resale values and you get gradually less and less money back the more ascensions you have

Auriel wrote:Rising Naquadah prices are a good thing.

After all, everyone produces Naquadah. Rising prices mean that there is effectively 'less' Naq in the streets. A very good thing.


Now.. where was the poll that said "Yay Update! Long live Jay!"?

i don't think it reduces the naq on the streets though as most of those on the cash market (not to be confused with the in game cash market) as those selling naq for cash on the forums are done with ascending for the most part.

what this means is those selling naq will have just as much to sell but will probably sell for more.

their will still be the same amount of naq passing hands just less cash going to the developers through supporter packs

this is the only update i have a problem with the rest seem logical. this change just doesnt feel right to me

kamujian wrote:i don't think it reduces the naq on the streets though as most of those on the cash market (not to be confused with the in game cash market) as those selling naq for cash on the forums are done with ascending for the most part.

what this means is those selling naq will have just as much to sell but will probably sell for more.

their will still be the same amount of naq passing hands just less cash going to the developers through supporter packs

this is the only update i have a problem with the rest seem logical. this change just doesnt feel right to me

Ah, I see what you mean. I can also see why you'd not agree with it.
I need some time to rethink my answer.. I had it but I forgot.

hmm if the cash market prices go up, wouldnt it be a good oppertunity for the game to keep their current supporter pack prices; effectively comming off as the cheaper supplier ?.

Could swing in their favour, less cash gets transfered over the market, more stuff gets bought from the game itself.

I guess they wouldn't mind that