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Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:15 am
by urogard
fixing this would require most likely to rewrite at most 1-2 lines of code (at least would be if i'd be coding this), would take 30 secs tops and could result in something like the following principle:
fraction of attack of ms #1 to defense of ms #2 is equal to the fraction of 3% (or whatever the percentage of shields/weapons lost) of shields destroyed, with max destroyable is the 3% (or whatever the percentage of shields/weapons lost) stated
seriously 4 pages of discussion about a useless topic
and 50 bil naq that this won't get fixed for at least a month (considering the time it takes to fix it) if at all
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:50 am
by Wolf359
Just like to point out that there was already a discussion on this, on the first suggestions page:viewtopic.php?f=13&t=127182
Please use search/look at other posts before making new ones in the future as this discussion could quite legitimately have taken place in that thread. However, this one will remain open as it has outgrown the other (may merge at a later date).Something probably does need to be done regarding MS - but also bear in mind that the bigger something is, the easier it is to hit; the smaller it is, the harder it is to hit - that would also need to be considered in any alteration to the code.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:04 am
by GeneralChaos
Wolf359 wrote:
Something probably does need to be done regarding MS - but also bear in mind that the bigger something is, the easier it is to hit; the smaller it is, the harder it is to hit - that would also need to be considered in any alteration to the code.
In that case why can we not use 1 attacker against 1mill defenders, same rules apply, bigger army should be easier to kill......
Or the same rule apply to the old AC trick, threw massive Defense......
These where both patched so why not MS's......
I could build up my MS and mass the biggest one in the game, sure it would cost me to repair, up until the point where said person was no longer doing damage, but i could still do this so much cheaper in compared to building to said size to do it, and i can do it using 1 AT because ADMIN flat out refuses to fix that crap.
Bottom line, something needs done.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:09 am
by jedi~tank
KSM wrote:I'm sorry Deni but what you are doing is whining. You want it to cost them more simply because you don't like they can mass your ms cheaply. Why should it cost them more? It's a suicide mission basically. If I massed your ms with my ms and had no shields I would expect to get blown up but if I hit you enough times without you repairing, your shields would eventually drop to where I could break them. So say the total cost is 500 bill to mass your ms with replacing volleys and such. That doesn't include me rebuilding my ms back to its full capacity afterwards if I so wish to do. In the end all you lose is the amount it costs to rebuild your ms. I would have to keep throwing volleys in while I'm massing you and then rebuild afterwards. It's not like I hit you with a 30 bill ms strike and I break your shields instantly, it takes awhile. And all it takes to stop it is be online or have someone in your alliance hit the ms thats hitting you and take it out. They can't do damage to you if they are being sat on by your alliance mates. If this happened to me I wouldn't be on the forums saying its not right. I would be asking why my alliance mates didn't help protect my ms and sit on who was massing me.
STHU and participate in a constructive manner.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 11:38 am
by KSM
Jedi~Tank wrote:KSM wrote:I'm sorry Deni but what you are doing is whining. You want it to cost them more simply because you don't like they can mass your ms cheaply. Why should it cost them more? It's a suicide mission basically. If I massed your ms with my ms and had no shields I would expect to get blown up but if I hit you enough times without you repairing, your shields would eventually drop to where I could break them. So say the total cost is 500 bill to mass your ms with replacing volleys and such. That doesn't include me rebuilding my ms back to its full capacity afterwards if I so wish to do. In the end all you lose is the amount it costs to rebuild your ms. I would have to keep throwing volleys in while I'm massing you and then rebuild afterwards. It's not like I hit you with a 30 bill ms strike and I break your shields instantly, it takes awhile. And all it takes to stop it is be online or have someone in your alliance hit the ms thats hitting you and take it out. They can't do damage to you if they are being sat on by your alliance mates. If this happened to me I wouldn't be on the forums saying its not right. I would be asking why my alliance mates didn't help protect my ms and sit on who was massing me.
STHU and participate in a constructive manner.
cute jt
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:56 pm
by urogard
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:58 pm
by jedi~tank
Kids on these forums constantly taking shots at every chance is absurd to the nth degree.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:11 pm
by KSM
Jedi~Tank wrote:Kids on these forums constantly taking shots at every chance is absurd to the nth degree.
yet you telling someone STHU isn't absurd and childlike?
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:33 pm
by urogard
KSM wrote:Jedi~Tank wrote:Kids on these forums constantly taking shots at every chance is absurd to the nth degree.
yet you telling someone STHU isn't absurd and childlike?
i'll have to second that jedi's comment wasn't very "smart"
but ksm your analogy is severly flawed.
With your explanation it should be possible to deduce that if a 1 week old baby hits long enough onto an adult, it will eventually kill that adult.
i think we can both agree it's ridiculous. So is the idea that a mothership which offensive power is a minuscule fraction of the defending mothership's defense should be next to impossible to do any real damage with, which however isn't the case
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 3:04 am
by Wolf359
GeneralChaos wrote:Wolf359 wrote:
Something probably does need to be done regarding MS - but also bear in mind that the bigger something is, the easier it is to hit; the smaller it is, the harder it is to hit - that would also need to be considered in any alteration to the code.
In that case why can we not use 1 attacker against 1mill defenders, same rules apply, bigger army should be easier to kill......
Or the same rule apply to the old AC trick, threw massive Defense......
These where both patched so why not MS's......
I could build up my MS and mass the biggest one in the game, sure it would cost me to repair, up until the point where said person was no longer doing damage, but i could still do this so much cheaper in compared to building to said size to do it, and i can do it using 1 AT because ADMIN flat out refuses to fix that crap.
Bottom line, something needs done.
I agree - something does need done. But your analogy is a little off - if you have a 1 v 1 million situation, then the 1 million is not easier to kill, but they would be easier to hit (as a larger MS is easier to hit than a smaller one) - so you could reasonably expect more casualties from the 1 million than you would from the 1 (since there is only 1 to kill).
Don't really want to get into this again, as me and Lore did it to death recently! Suffice to say that size shouldn't be discounted if there is going to be any re-write of the MS code.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:25 am
by Fire_of_Venus
Why is it always assumed that MSs get bigger as they get more capacity? While some increase in size is expected I suppose why can't this be offset by increased hull utilization and miniaturization of the weapons and shield units, which therefore make the MS smaller and harder to hit. Though admittedly when hit, more damaging with the current percentage based damage, hence the reason something to allow some consideration of relative strength needs to be done.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:09 pm
by Wolf359
It's called the laws of physics - you want to add more capacity to something - it gets bigger. You want to add 10,000 hangars or a couple of hundred thousand weapons/shield systems to a spacecraft - it gets bigger.
Unless of course you're saying that a MS is infinitely big when it is first built?
Just saying it should be considered if the code is reworked - that's all!
Like I said - don't really want to get into it here - happy to discuss via pm if necessary.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 5:11 pm
by Lore
Fire_of_Venus wrote:Why is it always assumed that MSs get bigger as they get more capacity? While some increase in size is expected I suppose why can't this be offset by increased hull utilization and miniaturization of the weapons and shield units, which therefore make the MS smaller and harder to hit. Though admittedly when hit, more damaging with the current percentage based damage, hence the reason something to allow some consideration of relative strength needs to be done.
I already tried to argue this point, good luck.
What I still cant understand is why 1 shield is as strong as 1K shields, stupid if you ask me.
More shields should equal thicker armor and = less damage. Not here, thicker armor = more damage. Meh
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 3:36 pm
by Wolf359
Yes - that is stupid.
Re: Mothership Massing
Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 5:52 pm
by Lore
Wolf359 wrote:Yes - that is stupid.
what exactly are you refering to?
If its what I said you have seriously stumped me mate LOL
