sovereignty & patriotism vs all...

[Kit-Fox]

How they would have found out isnt important, the fact that the treat was there would have been enough for the Irish just like it was for the British.

People dont want to risk losing their jobs, so they'll vote as directed on the off chance their employer might find out

EDIT: Just to point out lots of Brits have said they only voted yes becuase of the threat to their jobs from thier employer. They have regretted it since

[Legendary Apophis]

How they would have found out isnt important, the fact that the treat was there would have been enough for the Irish just like it was for the British.

People dont want to risk losing their jobs, so they'll vote as directed on the off chance their employer might find out

EDIT: Just to point out lots of Brits have said they only voted yes becuase of the threat to their jobs from thier employer. They have regretted it since

Oh yes it would be important, because that, would be a true grey area into democracy process, much more than doing a billion times same referundum (not saying it would be good, don't get me wrong)!
Anyway, I don't see why I would vote what people tell me to vote for with threats, as afterall, they wouldn't find it out, and they damn well know that! Unless I would talk about elections and "forget" to lie about whom I would have voted for.

[Kit-Fox]

How the employer isnt important at all Pops, not to the end result. That is that the people who are on the recieving end of such threats do as they are told to prevent any risk to their jobs/lives.

That the threat is made in the first place is really the issue & important.

And you can find out how someone votes in many ways, or least make a very 'educated guess'. Again people arent going to risk that knowledge or guess coming down against them, so they vote as directed to minimise risk to themsleves, their job & their family.

[Legendary Apophis]

How the employer isnt important at all Pops, not to the end result. That is that the people who are on the recieving end of such threats do as they are told to prevent any risk to their jobs/lives.

That the threat is made in the first place is really the issue & important.

And you can find out how someone votes in many ways, or least make a very 'educated guess'. Again people arent going to risk that knowledge or guess coming down against them, so they vote as directed to minimise risk to themsleves, their job & their family.

Personally, I would vote for whomever/whatever I want even if I'm threatend. Ireland and France aren't countries where you are controlled to who you vote for!
Whoever threatens me to vote for this or that can just **Filtered** off!

[Kit-Fox]

No they arent supposed to be countries where such control should happen, but it does happen.

And a large portion of the second Irish referendum Yes vote was based upon such cajoling, at least according to reports about the whole thing since it happened. It is much like the situation that happened in the UK in the 70s with our referendum.

You can say such things shouldnt happen etc but they can and do happen and they do affect the results. The results are effected even more so when a lot of the people eligible to vote decided not to bother a second time round as they knew they wouldnt be listened to again & would just be forced to do the whole thing over & over until the answer the EU wanted was given.

Hence undemcratic, especially more so considering that the second one was illegal under Irish law (at least in the format & timing of how it happened)

[BenjaminMS]

Oh ... my...

Splitting my answers up...

@ EU.. it's an vast monster which is bureaucratic as hell and certain procedures should be considered illegal... like pushing the Lissabon treaty through while the majority of the European 'citizens' didn't like it. Anyway...

@ Sovereignity vs Patriotism...
Uhm?

Although the EU is considered a union, it's no nation/country/state. Since if you live in the EU because your nation is member of it you're considered 'European Union citizen', doesn't mean it should be different loyalties...
Being pro-EU isn't the same as being pro-French if you live in France... EU is a region, France (or the UK, or Belgium, or the Netherlands for that matter) is a nation. Surely you can be pro-EU or against the EU... but it isn't automatically pro = against.
Pro-EU isn't automatically against-(nation), as pro-(nation) isn't against-EU (although the latter occurs often).