StarGateWars Forums

Forum wrote:1) you are being an idiot.
2) you are not correct on almost anything you've said to date.
3) rank is not affected by this -- a big or small covert score still only ranks you RELATIVE to others in covert. your covert rank is then averaged with the other ranks. (NOT scores...ranks... average of ranks...get it?)

SGBlackOps1 wrote:ah no it was easier before. but of course who give a frig it seems forum doesnt.

opps i was ........... damn.........that wasnt soposed to come out that way.

Erm... actually, as I said, I can see half my commander stats now when I couldn't before, so doesn't that theoretically means s/he's not as powerful as s/he was before? It's funny that this change happens now because we've been discussing covert these past few days. In any case, if this change will relieve load from the server, then the better it is.

Now that things have settled... here's my viewpoint. I don't have a problem with rebalancing coverts to make things more fair, but at the same time I think it was reduced too much. No longer is a quality over quantity, it's grab as many members as you can, no matter how weak they are.

If you run the numbers, you'll understand what's going on. The changes make spy level a little less meaningful and spies a little more meaningful. If you can afford spy level 21-27, good for you, but you aren't going to instantly double your score anymore. Every 2 spy levels gives you a little less than twice your current score. That probably means that each player will find a spy level that suits them and stick with it while they pile in troops. And I'm not talking unrealistic numbers of troops here either. Between raiding and decent up, any serious player shouldn't have a problem.

I am sadly left strongly in the negative of this latest update.
It was just a needless try at rebalancing the game and has caused a total shift in power.
Normally I can understand the Admin’s decisions and agree with them,
but honestly I am really pissed off by the fact that he gave no warning of this latest covert change.
From now on I believe that we should be informed before these updates.
This would allow us all to have input and understand his reasons for game altering changes.
As for this change I can see no reason for it and I am with a lot of other players in my opinion that the update is one that is not wanted.

If he has posted any form of warning about this then may someone please direct me to it.

I don't appear to have dropped anything.

I too have stayed about the same rank.

KibaWolf - who are you to make demands such as this 'Normally I can understand the Admin’s decisions and agree with them,
but honestly I am really pissed off by the fact that he gave no warning of this latest covert change.
From now on I believe that we should be informed before these updates..'?

Just to analyse that - it seems it is okay for Forum to introduce changes as long as you agree with them?

Get real will you! Wake up and smell the bacon!

Throughout the life of the game, some changes have been made unnanounced - and, where a significant amount of constructive criticsm is given it has been listened to and, if necessary, the update amended or removed.

However, I have yet to see any constructive criticsm within any thread on why this update should be removed! All I have seen are people whining because their covert levels have dropped, and their ranks have changed!

Well, if you had bothered to read even half the posts in each topic then you would know exactly why things have changed and people have been going up and down in ranks. But no, it's much easier to complain than to read peoples constructive comments and try to see beyond the realms of your own account isn't it!?

And - do you not actually read what is being posted:

Forum wrote:rank is not affected by this -- a big or small covert score still only ranks you RELATIVE to others in covert. your covert rank is then averaged with the other ranks. (NOT scores...ranks... average of ranks...get it?)

The reason you see no reason for the change is because you have not actually bothered to look at what the change actually is and does!

Severely annoyed Mod!

After looking this over it is very clear that the only problem with this is how it relates to anti covert. AC is going to be the wave to catch to drive your covert rank up. Since there is two levels more of power associated with AC then with covert on the surface it appears that the thing to do is buy AC levels and train assasins.

Trained assasins cannot be hurt so your rank with covert is always safe, and alliances that train high in AC cannot be dislodged by an act of war either. So if you want the best return on your income go anti covert. You get rank, your alliance gets much more power, and your units are safe from anyone killing them.

Well Radium, you're half right, Anti Covert can be a better than Covert as far as rankings go, but Anti Spies can and do die in attacks and raids. Basically, Covert is useful and Anti-Covert is for ranking. I know a guy ranked in the 600's who hasn't got a single point of anti-covert and he plans to leave it that way. It all depends on how people want to play, but yes, Anti Covert gets two free levels.

If wolfy and admin could read this... im a little confused.

IDK if this is possible..... I havent time to work it out, nd YES my rank has still stayed the same.. but there seems to be alot of people saying that theirs has changed.... so I thought for a moment.

Say before the change there is 2 people, someone with:

GUY 1: lv24 covert and 50k spies and...
GUY 2: lv20 covert and 800k spies.

let's say.. before the update they had the same power.

Now, with the update in place, spies do the same amount of power, BUT covert level's multiply covert by less.

{-Before (2^spy level)-} Each level times covert by 2
{-After (1.5^spy level)-} Each level times covert by 1.5

<-BEFORE->
Guy1 Aprox. 840 billion covert = 50,000spies x (2^24)
Guy2 Aprox. 840 billion covert = 800,000spies x (2^20)

<-AFTER->
Guy1 Aprox. 840 million covert = 50,000spies x (1.5^24)
Guy2 Aprox. 2.6 billion covert = 800,000spies x (1.5^20)


It MAY well be wrong.. im not to good at calaculations... but its worth a check

Im not good with calculations, im not doing this for my benefit, and it took up my time, so dont bother criticizing me

Phoenix, although I don't know the formula from before the change, you are over simplifying the math. I can tell you the after scores for both of your examples if they were asgard with both tech upgrades, but I can't tell you what they'd be before.

50k at level 24 Asgard both techs would be 3,318,260,000

800k at level 20 Asgard with both techs would be 13,279,040,000

I may be off a decimal place on the last one.

But the guy with 800k has 16 times the troops. I think that even before the change he would have been ahead.

Phoenix of Skycon wrote:
50k at level 24 Asgard both techs would be 3,318,260,000

800k at level 20 Asgard with both techs would be 13,279,040,000

I may be off a decimal place on the last one.

But the guy with 800k has 16 times the troops. I think that even before the change he would have been ahead.

See, that's the thing... before the change they would have been very close to equal, now it's not even close. Spy levels are just a HUGE waste of naq now. Those people that keep saying that his had no effect on relative ranks, you need to run your math again because I can assure you that it DID have an effect on ranks.

Granted that spy levels aren't as valuable as they once were, 800k troops still costs more if you bought it straight from the black market at 300 mil per 1k troops than buying spy levels 21-24 inclusive. 240 tril could be made from the 800k troops where as those 4 levels cost roughly 100 bil. Spy levels have always been easier to obtain than uu is. Now the math supports that reality.

If I had 100 billion naq to spend, I could come up with somewhere in the area of 770k UU. It might take a while, but I guarantee it could be done. The thing is there's a point where it's not really worth obtaining more spy levels because it would be easier to obtain UU. Before, that point was pretty high, now it's considerably lower and many people are already beyond that point.

If those people happened to sell some UU to obtain the naq for their spy levels, then they are getting even more screwed over by this change. Before = worth it, after = bent over without the lube.

Reeb wrote:If those people happened to sell some UU to obtain the naq for their spy levels, then they are getting even more screwed over by this change. Before = worth it, after = bent over without the lube.

I hear you on that, but I figure this change that I have been able to use to my advantage makes up for the market change which ended up hosing me over for getting market access when I did. I think I got hosed anyway.