StarGateWars Forums

Aetom wrote:
There should be certain boundaries set up, separating the men from the boys. Like, a certain number of ranks below each of their ranks (strike, defence, covert, anti-covert, commadn star and influence), to protect 400-700 players from being attacked by 1-2-300 players.

problem then becomes big accounts sitting back in the lower ranks for protection or dropping down to attack the lower ranked people.

scben wrote:

Aetom wrote:
There should be certain boundaries set up, separating the men from the boys. Like, a certain number of ranks below each of their ranks (strike, defence, covert, anti-covert, commadn star and influence), to protect 400-700 players from being attacked by 1-2-300 players.

problem then becomes big accounts sitting back in the lower ranks for protection or dropping down to attack the lower ranked people.

That's why we should do what Dregg said...except if you read my previous post, it may not work that way either.

And there's still always that problem of powerful ppl striking down weaker ppl just for laughs.

Aetom wrote:

scben wrote:

Aetom wrote:
There should be certain boundaries set up, separating the men from the boys. Like, a certain number of ranks below each of their ranks (strike, defence, covert, anti-covert, commadn star and influence), to protect 400-700 players from being attacked by 1-2-300 players.

problem then becomes big accounts sitting back in the lower ranks for protection or dropping down to attack the lower ranked people.

That's why we should do what Dregg said...except if you read my previous post, it may not work that way either.

And there's still always that problem of powerful ppl striking down weaker ppl just for laughs.

If it takes hundreds and hundreds of AT's to descend someone, which is what it shuold, even if theyre much weaker, trust me, noone will be wastin those precious AT's for laughs... theyll be savin them up for their arch-nemesis... Everyone in this game has some, maybe even dozens, and the real powerful players in ascnesion have more than average... They'll be saving AT's for those guys.

Firstly if this is all descension involves then I will be disapointed. After all this time it seems a little weak to have them unable to play ascended for a week. That said I am just so glad that something is finally happening that I'll accept what ever.

If there's a rank modifier then no one will EVER be descended.

If I attack player a until he's maxed out his defence will be gone but I won't be able to finish him until a few turns later but as his defence is gone he's dropped rank by then.

As for the market place - I think it would be disgusting to see ascended accounts turned into pure resource farms. PLEASE leave this out of the game. Leave the trading for main.

sorry forum i dont like this proposal so much

i do like shooting star's and chunky's proposal though. thats what i thought it was going to be like so im ascending slow and making my ascension account powerful. but if this is all descension will be... it kind of takes that work away. with all the attack turns taken to descend someone there is no reason that it is only a 1 month problem and they get to keep there weapons.

i know those points have been stated but i thought id restate them

chunkysoup wrote:

Aetom wrote:

scben wrote:

Aetom wrote:
There should be certain boundaries set up, separating the men from the boys. Like, a certain number of ranks below each of their ranks (strike, defence, covert, anti-covert, commadn star and influence), to protect 400-700 players from being attacked by 1-2-300 players.

problem then becomes big accounts sitting back in the lower ranks for protection or dropping down to attack the lower ranked people.

That's why we should do what Dregg said...except if you read my previous post, it may not work that way either.

And there's still always that problem of powerful ppl striking down weaker ppl just for laughs.

If it takes hundreds and hundreds of AT's to descend someone, which is what it shuold, even if theyre much weaker, trust me, noone will be wastin those precious AT's for laughs... theyll be savin them up for their arch-nemesis... Everyone in this game has some, maybe even dozens, and the real powerful players in ascnesion have more than average... They'll be saving AT's for those guys.

That's a relief...

smooshable wrote:If there's a rank modifier then no one will EVER be descended.

If I attack player a until he's maxed out his defence will be gone but I won't be able to finish him until a few turns later but as his defence is gone he's dropped rank by then.

Yes, that would be a problem, but again, it will take a very powerful ascended being to decend someone, correct?
You're maxed out at 2000 turns..(I mean absolutely NO offence to anyone by this)..and if you can't destroy that person in 2K turns, why are you even bothering to wipe him out? 2K turns and 30 minutes.

I don't agree that only one person should be able to God attack someone at a time just from a purely 'series realism' standpoint. In the series it was always 'the others' that descended someone, not one all powerful person. Just throwing out another possibility to see how it is welcomed, how about it takes not one, but say 5 people to fully descend someone. I still think it should cost each of those 5 people what one person would have to expend (so yes, making descension 5x harder) so it is still a big deal even with more people. Or maybe make it 3 people minimum each doing at least 1/5 of the damage, and if you have 10 more, they can make up the other 2/5 of it. Also, I totally think there should be absolutely no rank limits on the God attacks, it totally defeats the purpose.

Also, if people want a more permament effect on the main account, rather then losing an ascension (the +5% in each stat) stick with having the embarassment (whatever that is), and the 1 month no bonuses, and as a long term damage, randomly strike down parts of the person's account. Think about it, if there is a war between ascended beings, wouldn't their phyiscal realm take some damage? I'm thinking something fairly random, like 0.1-5% of miners killed, 0.1-5% of spies killed, 0.1-5% of weapons destroyed, etc, etc, etc meaning the account would suffer damage proportional to the main account. The player would just get a message saying something like "Due to astronomical energy bursts, you have lost 524005 miners, 1259 weapons, 6234 spies, 236 attack super soldiers, 2366 fighters, etc, etc ,etc." That way it's not as permament as losing 5% in every stat, but still requires some rebuilding for the long term as well, and would do proportional damage depending on the account.

I like it forum, although I'm also not opposed to the idea of the person's Main account losing one level (5% bonus) after the month has expired.

So say STI ascended again with everything he has right now.. he would have billions and billions of points to use. he'd be powerfull enough to sit there and take out everyone with little effort.

ThePolice wrote:So say STI ascended again with everything he has right now.. he would have billions and billions of points to use. he'd be powerfull enough to sit there and take out everyone with little effort.

we've said this before - descending someone will require LARGE scale (and probably GROUP) effort

I don't really like it because it sounds like there is now absolutely no reason to ascend.

First, we lose all ascended bonus from our main account, but this is too much because ascended weapons are already much worse than main weapons. At the very least, we should regain the bonuses of our main race we ascended from (go'auld for system lords, asguard for ancients etc). This will mean we still lose alot but descension will not be worse than never ascending in the first place.

Second, there is no way you can stop someone from descending you. On main, if you are getting attacked you can go on PPT or vacation mode or use Nox insurance or repair your weapons & train more men, or have an ally send you stuff so that you can strengthen your defense. Now the only thing you can do is go on vacation mode and it sounds like people are wanting vacation mode to have the same penalties as descention.. that's just crazy. And there is no way to recover the damage you are suffering from being attacked, you can't even sell weapons to change into APP since your weapons will be destroyed immediately by their God attacks. So there is nothing you can do but suck up attacks and eventually be descended.

Finally, since there is no time limit between god attacks then you will never have any warning if you are about to be descended. It should take at least a day to fully descend someone, so that if they are paying attention they can escape to vacation mode until they have time to organize their friends to try and descend the people trying to descend them.

Some possibilities that could make this better:

* if you try and descend someone, you should suffer the same damage as you inflict on them. this will mean that people who try and descend you will be seriously weakened and that they will have to attack you in groups.

* when you lose your reserve energy, you should only be able to be attacked once every turn. This will slow down people attacking you and give you time to negotiate/counterattack/look for allies.

* after being descended you should merely be reduced to the bonuses of your shell account instead of having no bonuses at all. this will mean that there is no real drawback to ascending and encourage people to take advantage of the ascension server.

In conclusion I think it is too easy to descend someone without fear of retaliation and unless people are able to do something to defend themself then the penalties for descension should be limitied.

Well to be honest I started to post here but I realized I was starting a debate and not actually posting in regards to the potential update.
I will post a GenLucky style reply tomorrow sometime after I sit down and figure things up a bit more in detail and run numbers.

As many know I believe in figuring things out that benefit everyone. I do like the idea so far but there is some other checks and balances that would need to be put in place I think to maintain a sense of balance without tipping things incredably too much to one side or the other.

I have no problems with anything that is released or proposed but there are a lot of details that are somewhat missing that leave me at incomplete conclusion on if this would actually be a workable method.

#1 If I am being descended I can go on vacation mode and keep playing my main account then ascend and build up things so I can't be descended. I believe if you are vacation mode in ascension you should be likewise in main as well. Once again I know this is a old and touchy subject and probably rather difficult to code into things. But if you want the glory of being a Living God then the responsabilities of being an ascended being should be taken as seriously as the shell account that gives you serious ascended bonuses.

#2 How exactly will descension math work out? Using the self stats I am sure but how exactly will it work? I am sure it is not only continginant on your skill levels as I am sure there must be a multipler in there somewhere too. AS everything in ascension uses something else as a multiplier of some sort so is the self levels multipliers of command star or something? And how are reserves tabulated as being reduced?

#3 If you are descended do you lose 1 ascension level or do you lose all of them? The reason I ask this is that If you have ascended 6 times should being descended 1 time knock you totally into the mortal plane?
#3a And if the above is a decrease of all of them then there is a serious issue when it comes to encouragment of new players to the game to ascend with so much as risk. Or on the other hand of being descended 1 level of ascension per descension is there a check in place to ensure that said person can't immediatly ascend again to regain their full power even after the 1 month period?
I like the concept but there is a lot of other things that are needed to be given serious consideration and thought to not only the immediate ramifications but long term as well.

I have seen mention of the Cosmic Market Place again and quite frankly I think there is no need for one. Geting turns on the limited level we do now keeps the game a bit more stable and strategic and if people need a market so badly they can ascend again to suppliment their ascended acount as many have exceeded 6 ascensions already.

Like I have said, I have no problems with anything admin wants to impliment. However I would like a lot more detail on things to provide a complete response based on all the information.

4 pages is alot to read so I will just say this, I like it but I think that the main bonuses should be held from the main account until that person ascends again in main to regain everything that was lost in their main account.

Ascension was suuposed to be a way for you to level the playing field to an extent so make it so that it costs something to regain what you lost in main.

well this is gonna be the worst update ever

OK...

Forum, I like the basic idea, but as many have said, it seems too soft. After all, when Daniel was returned to his corporeal state, he had no powers of any kind, no memory of himself before he ascended, and no memory of the time he spent as an ascended being--even though he regained all of the former and some of the latter. As I understand it in-game, the bonuses to your "shell" main account are due to the knowledge you have from being ascended--if descended, you should lose all bonuses for a given period of time, if not permanently.

As for losing everything you have in main save UU/Miners and spy lvls(whoever said that), come on, what a joke! Lose the benefits of ascending (weps converted into naq so you can re-buy the "normal" versions of them, same for M-Ship Fleets), but don't burn the physical plane to the ground UNLESS the physical plane (main) must be devastated to be able to hurt the ascended being as well (which would be virtually impossible).

As to the vac mode issue, don't force a vac on one to create a vac on the other. Instead (if this is possible, but it should be from what little I know of programming), set it up so that if you have been on vacation in Ascension for X amount of time, you lose the bonuses in main temporarily--i.e. until you come off vacation.