StarGateWars Forums

lifers were introduced into game... because there was a big objection to a few biger ppl buyn off evry1s mts and getting big uu from them on a larger scale.. as the market was dynamic at that point.. theey also manipulated it and gaind alot form it... (eg all sold at once.. flooded theuus.. on next turn all bought... at alot cheaper rate)..

to prevent all that, and the creation of the first bigsized "oligarhy" ... remember we are talkign pre raiding times....
market started selling lifers.. instead of uu.. thus ppl couldnt do that.

at that point the solution was good, but armysizes were much smaller, ammount of lifers was alot smaler, and most ppl barely began their first ascensions... if a player is to go for 10 ascensions now.. he can easlyy have more than 100mil lifers on his account... at some poitn, that might present a problem.

killing ACs was introduced to sort that problem a bit, and addres the untoutchabe "acing" units...
the problem that is being discussed here, is that that solution was not a solution at all.

Due to the ridiculus rate no1 realy toutches it (aside HE who was tryn to make a point that he can be crazy )
I woulnt try lifer suicide at 5:1 if i was dead drunk personaly
at 2:1 i d have to be at least medicore drunk to do it, so only on good weekends

like i said in my "first personal viev post"
my kill count while massing is 1:8 at least
which makes 2:1 lifer suicide still 16x worse to use than massing.

if an alternative route is taken there can always be restrctions put in place... to keep some lifers on the accounts such as you can not rehabilitate more 50% of your accounts total population or soething. or theres at least 20% lifers min lower than that rehab doesnt work (each universe has to have its share of junkies )

anyhow i m glad the discussion is still going on well, hopefuly admin likes the player input on wen.

New solution would be kikaz

SVaRuN wrote:I suggested and am still sticking to the:

A new Technology:

The Technology on rehabilitating lifers would work as the one with mercs...you would have levels and I would go with as far as 6 levels each giving you 15% lifers recovered so when you buy them all you are able to successfuly rehabilitate 90% of lifers
Each Tech upgrade would cost you 1 trill in naq giving it some actual value unlike the other Techs...and could only be reached later on in the game...meaning only bigger players older palyer would get to buy the tech, which does seem normal seeing how they are the ones who would actually need lifers converted into miners...

- Also lets face it the tech tree is old and hasnt recieved an addition in ages...



As for AC units killed I would seek another alternative:
- The current one I dont like:
first reason being the rate
the second being no risk while attacking...the attacker simply risks nothing...he knows how many he ll kill and can do it whenever he feels like it...no other technique comes without a risk...
Therefor I would do the following...
Player he has an alternative attack option smilar to ascension where he may hunt AC units with penetrating his defence and perhaps therefor loosing like at massing but perhaps adding a feature of losing 30 ats per attack...



Blue

I like that tech... with it fully upgraded to 90% there should be a rehabilitate lifer button... for my 59mill armysize I have 30million lifers... I dont mind sacrificing 3 million to get 27 mill as UU rather than lifers... that means with my buggered net access at home I could lend them out and hide in perg

perhaps make it useable once a week? on the market trade section? (but not as a market trade)

I like your suggestion on the killing of AC units too 30AT (have to use all 30AT) for a hit combining your covert/strike over a 0(3) defence and kills just like AC kills covert your main weapons should also take damage and your MS should not be involved in the attack... (like raiding doesnt send in AC troops)

edit** also your strike troops should die at a rate of 2.5% of strike troops killed per hit so if you kill 50k AC troops per hit you lose 1.75k strike troops on the attack

that sort of thing...

TheRook

edit 2 ** as a note to those saying they want to use this to their advantage and will only benefit the larger players as I've pointed out I'm not large probably medium sized now... but I have a lot of miners/lifers from big heavy ascensions... I think there should be away of rehabilitating some of them... after all if I decided to sell all my UU and go into purg... I cant... I have too many lifers... and my lifers will keep increasing as my armysize increases... so they are stopping me do what I want to do in game... they are cutting off how people want to play the game... and If I want to drop myself to 10-20mill armysize and sit in purg and teach people they need bigger defences then I want to be able to do just that... but im not going to kill 6 mill AC troops (5:1) just to do that... as thats rediculous... I would be better off setting fire to my home pc

i don't think you or anyone else has the right to move their UU just so they can go into perg to hunt down the very players that go into perg to get away from people like you!

thanks for bringing a scenario to light that no one else has touched on

Why should players that trained there UU into miners, knowing fully what it brings to the plate. Be rewarded with the chance to undo their choices?

The picture is pretty simple to understand, yet you guys keep trying to make exceptions for your your choices. You where all aware of it functions when you made your UU into miners what the outcome was. Nobody forced you by any means to train your UU as miners.

Also this 2:1 exchange rate for lifer sucide mission, doesnt make much sense. Slaves have not been trained to fight therefore how is it 2 of them can be capabale of taking down one man that has been trained to fight. It just makes no sense, and doesnt seem that 2 slaves would be difficult for a trained assassin to kill without dieing himself. And if this is an apporiate ratio, then how many Anti-coverts die when you send them into kill covert guys?

General Orion wrote: Nobody forced you by any means to train your UU as miners.

i disagree, raiding saw to it that we HAVE to put our UU somewhere and supers is not an option.

Again if you decide to make them into miners then that is your choice, but you can train them in AC or even straight attackers/defenders without upgrading them to Supers. But you decided to make them miners and therefor forfitted 10% of them. That was your choice to make.

ok my bad, i should have been more clear.

i want to farm and not have outrageous losses so training them into attackers is not an option. i don't want be "Educated" so training them in to defenders is not an option as is spies and AC for the same reason.

so the only safe place i can put them is in the mines, meaning i have to take a 10% loss.

i have a question, why not remove raiding instead? that way i have a REAL choice whether to train them as miners and take the 10% loss or not.

[SGC_ReplicÅtors] wrote:

Wolf359 wrote:Lifers are there for life - if you don't want them, then don't train UU into miners. Nobody forces you to have miners - the choice is ultimately yours - if you want more income, train UU into miners and accept 10% as lifers. If you don't want lifers, then don't train miners. Ultimately it's all down to account management, but some people always want the easiest of options.

You must be kidding right? dont train miners lol, this god forsaken game doesnt give u a choice in that matter...something called raiding will teach u or even force your hand to click on trained miners, i personally hate lifers never knew why they were put it but,

Theres a way of getting rid of them, just suicide them and replace them by raiding or buying UUs, dont like the work well thats too bad isnt

I know mate - but the point still stands - if you don't want lifers, then you don't have to train miners.

I'm with you though - just suicide them!

General Orion wrote:Also this 2:1 exchange rate for lifer sucide mission, doesnt make much sense. Slaves have not been trained to fight therefore how is it 2 of them can be capabale of taking down one man that has been trained to fight. It just makes no sense, and doesnt seem that 2 slaves would be difficult for a trained assassin to kill without dieing himself. And if this is an apporiate ratio, then how many Anti-coverts die when you send them into kill covert guys?

How come 2 guys on a plane took down one of the tallest buildings in the world... you know how many well trained ppl it took to build that building?

not tryn to offend any1... its just.. suicide mision doesnt take much training... you can stick your regular hillbily on a truck loaded with explosives and as dum as he is.. as long as he can drive in a strait line hes gonna take down half of the military base of "trained" ppl...
so your logic is flawed..

Do you think lifer suicide mision rate needs to be changed?
No curent rate 5:1 seems fair to me 10% 10% [ 15 ]
Yes 4:1 would be a fair rate 0% 0% [ 1 ]
Yes 3:1 would be a fair rate 8% 8% [ 12 ]
Yes 2:1 would be a fair rate 32% 32% [ 46 ]
Yes 10:1 would be a fair rate 5% 5% [ 8 ]
NO i would like to see an alternative solution 41% 41% [ 58 ] x

seems we have a winner?

Lore wrote:Do you think lifer suicide mision rate needs to be changed?
No curent rate 5:1 seems fair to me 10% 10% [ 15 ]
Yes 4:1 would be a fair rate 0% 0% [ 1 ]
Yes 3:1 would be a fair rate 8% 8% [ 12 ]
Yes 2:1 would be a fair rate 32% 32% [ 46 ]
Yes 10:1 would be a fair rate 5% 5% [ 8 ]
NO i would like to see an alternative solution 41% 41% [ 58 ] x

seems we have a winner?

Seeing as the admin meet is tomorrow, me think so.

well admin might wanna wait a bit longer.. for others to notice this, and so on. and like said we might just get a lower rate, instead of a totaly new solution if coding is too complicated.

thoug i ll bring the issue up on todays meet admin and post the sumup of admins, and others words.

Just show him the peoples desires. Coding some of the suggested ideas would be very easy. some would not.

I hope he goes for the combined covert/strike force attack at 30AT per hit... only works on 0 defense