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Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:36 am
by Nox
i deserved the warning, no prob, i was spamming, but my point is:
Mordack wrote:I've disciplined people from both sides for it, and I've even asked a fellow moderator to stop posting.
isnt the rules made for everyone?? shouldnt that mod get a warning also?? and in case he did 2 posts, shouldnt he get banned?? cause asked? whats that? maybe if you asked ppl would stop posting there also
how can the forum staff want ppl to be respectfull and follow the rules, if some of the staff does not, and get away with it ???
and still what i think is funny is this:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:08 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:38 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
so how exactly will a warning made 30s b4 the suspension be able to warn someone???
by the way, both posts that got the warnings were made hours b4
lol
following the rules is great, but blindly?? not giving ppl a chance?? if a mod would go to that thread, since the start, they will find at least 2 posts of everyone that posted there (mods included) that were against the rules, some probably made a couple of months ago, should those ppl get all suspended too??
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 5:01 am
by Solus
Nox wrote:i deserved the warning, no prob, i was spamming, but my point is:
Mordack wrote:I've disciplined people from both sides for it, and I've even asked a fellow moderator to stop posting.
isnt the rules made for everyone?? shouldnt that mod get a warning also?? and in case he did 2 posts, shouldnt he get banned?? cause asked? whats that? maybe if you asked ppl would stop posting there also
how can the forum staff want ppl to be respectfull and follow the rules, if some of the staff does not, and get away with it ???
and still what i think is funny is this:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:08 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:38 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
so how exactly will a warning made 30s b4 the suspension be able to warn someone???
by the way, both posts that got the warnings were made hours b4
lol
following the rules is great, but blindly?? not giving ppl a chance?? if a mod would go to that thread, since the start, they will find at least 2 posts of everyone that posted there (mods included) that were against the rules, some probably made a couple of months ago, should those ppl get all suspended too??
a. normal mods do not have the power to ban. super/globalmods do. the warnings might have been given by a regular mod and then when the next GM got on, they carried out the ban.
b. the rules have been set, and if ppl cant follow them, TOUGH. if after one warning in a 2 warn = ban setup, its FAIR to assume that when people are told the rules they will obey them, then when they receive a warning if they break it they'll take notice? ignorance is NOT an excuse for breaking the rules. the people banned got what they deserved under the rules, thats all there is to it.
c. my personal rule of thumb is that if I get to a thread after a while of posting, then its my fault for not catching offences sooner. so sneakily finding 2 offences in the appliccable threads then insta-banning is NOT an option. if they offend twice then i get to it after the 2nd offence, then ill generally only warn once classifying the two. BUT if theres one offence then i warn, then a second well after the person has had time to see the warning, then i will warn a second time:
i- for breaking the rules
ii- for ignoring/disobeying a moderator.
(to make it clear thats roughly how i do it, when modding in Misc. i beleive others do the same as me, if not similar.)
they deserved the warnings for breaking rules, and when ignoring/disobeying instruction to follow rules warranted the 2n and subsequent banning, such standards set in place where people have become increasingly disrespectful, an effort to kurb it.
~soul
'meh'
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 5:25 am
by Nox
reply:
a. I know, i was a mod here long ago, and these were made by the same gm, jack, as u can see in my quotes
b.agreed, rules are rules, but why do mods, that should know the rules better then anyone, get "asked" to stop, and ppl get warned/banned ??? arent rules for everyone, specially the ones that enforce them??
c.thats exactly my point, you do whats right, in this case, a mod came to the thread, saw 2 posts and banned, gave the 1st warning first right, 30 seconds b4 banning loll
thats my whole point right there, warnings are supposed to warn ppl not to do things again, if someone cant even see they got a warning how will they stop ????
maybe asking them like you do to other mods
lol
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:09 am
by Zeratul
NOTE: speaking as user not as mod...
we think one reason for lack of the courtesy of good time between warn and ban, is that some people are getting very tired of the continued misbehaving in those threads... not only have there been set up special rules for the threads, but many people have been banned for breaking those rules... so from one point of view, people have received not only the initial warning that came with the special rules, but also numerous warnings whenever people are banned for breaking said rules...
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:36 am
by deni
Nox wrote:i deserved the warning, no prob, i was spamming, but my point is:
Mordack wrote:I've disciplined people from both sides for it, and I've even asked a fellow moderator to stop posting.
isnt the rules made for everyone?? shouldnt that mod get a warning also?? and in case he did 2 posts, shouldnt he get banned?? cause asked? whats that? maybe if you asked ppl would stop posting there also
how can the forum staff want ppl to be respectfull and follow the rules, if some of the staff does not, and get away with it ???
and still what i think is funny is this:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:08 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
Jack edited Friday November 28th 2008 09:14:38 The following warning was issued to this user
» This is a warning regarding the following post made by you:
so how exactly will a warning made 30s b4 the suspension be able to warn someone???
by the way, both posts that got the warnings were made hours b4
lol
following the rules is great, but blindly?? not giving ppl a chance?? if a mod would go to that thread, since the start, they will find at least 2 posts of everyone that posted there (mods included) that were against the rules, some probably made a couple of months ago, should those ppl get all suspended too??
Posting of other user's IP adresses is considered posting of personal data and not allowed on these forums. I do not know how you did obtain the IP address from Manetheren's user notes as regular users do not have access to them but they were not for you to see nor to share with the entire forums.
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:01 am
by Nox
hehe, my 2nd warning in over 3 years of the forum, and all in this subject
sry about that deni, honestly i didnt even saw it was an ip address
and how did i get that info, simple, mane gave it to me
i dont have any special access here lol
im just a simple user
oh, and let me guess who was the mod that was "asked" to stop spamming or something in the war thread
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:17 am
by Mordack
Nox wrote:i deserved the warning, no prob, i was spamming, but my point is:
Mordack wrote:I've disciplined people from both sides for it, and I've even asked a fellow moderator to stop posting.
isnt the rules made for everyone?? shouldnt that mod get a warning also?? and in case he did 2 posts, shouldnt he get banned?? cause asked? whats that? maybe if you asked ppl would stop posting there also
how can the forum staff want ppl to be respectfull and follow the rules, if some of the staff does not, and get away with it ???
Discipline /= warn.
My own policy is always to ask users first, and then only warn in the event that they persist, or that people continue to post after a 'Stop! No more!' style post from a moderator. I went through the same system with that mod in question as I do for all users.
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:23 am
by Nox
well, thats the thing mordack,
you say, your own policy, void said he has his own rule of thumb, i agree with both of your own rules, but even so, a team has to work has a team, rules are rules and must be followed by all
if 1 gm follow the rules, another follows his own policies b4 following the rules, that doesnt give the rest of us something to hold on, cause it changes from person to person
i know this wont get anywhere, but i just wanted to see someone acknowledge that if jack followed the rules, like he did, giving a warning and 30 seconds later banning a member, for posts made hours b4 the warnings, not even letting the user see the warning, then most ppl, mods included would be banned also, if everyone followed the rules so blindly has he did in this situation
so pls, you guys should talk has a team, and work out the way to do your work, has one, not each one your own way
, and to benefit the comunity, not to have less work to do lol, cause at this rate you wont have anyone to mod lol
and ofc, those special rules, i simply dont get it, banned until the end of server war ??? but do you think it will end ? lol might aswell say, create a new account cause that one you'll never use again here in the forum
why cant it be just for 1month or so? and after 2 bans on the same situation, then ban for the end of war/forever or something, but this, is way too harsh, and all it does is just a few ppl posting, most from what i can see are mods
give ppl a chance and you might be suprised
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:28 am
by Jack
Nox wrote:reply:
a. I know, i was a mod here long ago, and these were made by the same gm, jack, as u can see in my quotes
b.agreed, rules are rules, but why do mods, that should know the rules better then anyone, get "asked" to stop, and ppl get warned/banned ??? arent rules for everyone, specially the ones that enforce them??
c.thats exactly my point, you do whats right, in this case, a mod came to the thread, saw 2 posts and banned, gave the 1st warning first right, 30 seconds b4 banning loll
thats my whole point right there, warnings are supposed to warn ppl not to do things again, if someone cant even see they got a warning how will they stop ????
maybe asking them like you do to other mods
lol
What part of he was verbally warned 20 times to take that discussion elsewhere? Even going by Void's policy, which some of was inherited from me, he would have still been banned.
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:41 am
by Nox
again jack, you dont get it, i cant make you get it
ive been trying at least
my point was always the oficial warnings, they are made to warn users, you didnt give a choice, you didnt warned anyone lol
those verbal warnings, were all made has a response to another user post, and a couple of times for what i can, you said and this goes for everyone, but those 2 situations were for 2 diferent subjects, at least thats what i see
and im guessing that asking part, mordack said, wasnt in a post, saying "to everyone else" but in a pm most probably
did you do that? sent a verbal warning in a pm??
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:17 am
by Jack
No I didn't send it in a PM, as I'm not about to message the entire forum. Besides, that isn't an excuse, he posted right after I posted to tell everyone to stop. He then reposted something he knew another user was warned and banned for.
When you see mod text, you need to read the mod text. There is no excuse not to, and if you get banned because you wouldn't take the time to read what is right in front of your face, then the problem is yours, not mine.
There's really no excuse for his behavior, he disobeyed a mod and he reposted something that he knew got another user warned and banned for. I don't know about your world, but here in the real one, if a cop sees you doing 90 in a 20, he's not going to give you a warning, he's going to haul your ass off to jail. Fact of the matter is, I caught Manetheren doing 90 in a 20, even after he had many giant signs warning him not to.
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:20 pm
by Solus
Nox wrote:c.thats exactly my point, you do whats right, in this case, a mod came to the thread, saw 2 posts and banned, gave the 1st warning first right, 30 seconds b4 banning loll
thats my whole point right there, warnings are supposed to warn ppl not to do things again, if someone cant even see they got a warning how will they stop ????
my point is SIMPLY that after requests from a moderator to stop certain things then continuing and getting a warning (first one) they will know what to stop doing. if they cant follow the rules in an area in which they know is being monitored heavily, they can only expect punishment if they continue to act in the same manner after said warning and instruction. 30 seconds, 60 seconds, 2 minutes, 4 minutes, it doesnt matter. the point is ignorance isnt an excuse, you say you were a moderator here, then you of all people should understand this VERY simple concept.
~soul
'meh again'
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:29 pm
by Zeratul
as we said earlier, nox... everyone have received multiple warnings...
- first the one with the special rules...
- then the subsequent ones where people still misbehave... (no, they're not specifically addressed to more than some few... but one should still heed them)
- then finally everyone should get it when people again break rules, and get banned... (yes, its not everyone getting banned... but still people should take the point)
still after those (shock) three warnings, people misbehave... and then they complain over the technicality that they havent received two warnings addressed specifically to them, even when they should have noticed three different warning types, and innumerable examples of each of two of those types...
you (should be able to) see from the above that technically, we mods could ban people for just misbehaving even once in those threads... that would be following the rules to the extremes... what jack has done occasionally, is not even as extreme as that, so its not as extreme as you might think...
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:03 am
by Nox
still zeratull, being banned for the duration of the war is completly nonsense, it doesnt make any logic whatsoever, all it does is make it harder for ppl to post on the market to buy at's basicaly
jack, sry again to come after you lolll, but i just checked the ban list and you posted:
Jack's Ghost wrote:Whereub banned for the duration of the server war.
well, first of all, when whereub tries to login it says:
Information
You have been permanently banned from this board.
Please contact the Board Administrator for more information.
A ban has been issued on your username.
permanently, not till the duration of the war (well, for me is the same thing lol)
and ive been searching his posts, and i havent found any recently where he has gone against the rules
did you delete it ???
and if it was till the end of the war, im guessing it was in the war thread right?
or ppl with 3 warnings, outside the war thread, now get banned till the end of the war also?
Re: For the duration of the server war??
Posted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:29 am
by Zeratul
nox, the field where it says "permanently" is a time field, where a set date and time is inserted... if you can us the exact time and date of the end of the server war, then we'll be happy to change the time for all those banned till end of the server war to that...
also, just so you know, there's a list being kept of all those banned for server war, and they'll all be unbanned come end of war...