July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

just a quick note to state the the whole point of this topic (started by me) is for you, the players, to provide feedback on the 'real life' effects of the updates, in the main live server, so we can addess imbalances or issues.
Is massing too expensive? Is sab too powerful? house bonus too strong, etc etc --- state it here, after trying it out, and we can address it. Will everyone be happy with everything? maybe not, but we will do our best to make the best decisions for the bulk of folks, and for the game overall.

so don't fret yet :) just opinionate....



odji nsu wrote:...But your updates are making ......
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Forum wrote:just a quick note to state the the whole point of this topic (started by me) is for you, the players, to provide feedback on the 'real life' effects of the updates, in the main live server, so we can addess imbalances or issues.
Is massing too expensive? Is sab too powerful? house bonus too strong, etc etc --- state it here, after trying it out, and we can address it. Will everyone be happy with everything? maybe not, but we will do our best to make the best decisions for the bulk of folks, and for the game overall.

so don't fret yet :) just opinionate....



odji nsu wrote:...But your updates are making ......


Well a major problem IMO is it's no longer possible to 0 a defence with just standard attack if the person is on nox+critical. On the 3-4 attempts I have made so far, they phase everytime, even when using just 3 turns per attack. Sure you could then try and drop in a few sabs to finish the job off. But it's kinda irritating to spend that long massing to see them phase.

N.B I am fully aware you can mass under their defence to stop them phasing...but then it start to get really costly!
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Try massing slightly under. You will take similar losses, but they will not phase.

I know i was being massed once, and was loosing about 50k super/hit. I only had 5m, so after 100 hits, they would all be dead, and the defence 0'd. This is with them hitting me with 15AT. So, i would have phased, but with hardly and units/weapons left.

IMO, i like them J. The improved sab power makes it much more useful, and a tactic to be considered.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Too many surveys not paying out properly, even though they were completed and/or met description requirements....

Plus, way too many times these surveys run you thru 10-20 mins. of pages + questions.....only to be told "Sorry, this survey is not your type" or some similar nonsense after going thru all of the stuff, anyways. You complete the "pre-questions" that they use to choose the right type for you....but they still give you one that ends up being the wrong type and cannot be finished...making you start all over 20 mins. later. after 2 hours and nearly a dozen repetitive tries, it gets just...a...little......Ridiculous.

Would really help to have surveys that can actually be completed normally.

2 out of 8 or 9 is NOT a good average for ones that actually paid out vs. ones that did not, and/or have a lot of repetitive nonsense as described above.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Forum wrote:just a quick note to state the the whole point of this topic (started by me) is for you, the players, to provide feedback on the 'real life' effects of the updates, in the main live server, so we can addess imbalances or issues.
Is massing too expensive? Is sab too powerful? house bonus too strong, etc etc --- state it here, after trying it out, and we can address it. Will everyone be happy with everything? maybe not, but we will do our best to make the best decisions for the bulk of folks, and for the game overall.

so don't fret yet :) just opinionate....



odji nsu wrote:...But your updates are making ......



sorry if it seemed i was fretting, lol,, just letting you know my opinion,,

that massing is impossible due to the time it takes cause of them phasing to easy,, some complain about the cost, I have no issue with it costing more, just the time it requires to mass, I like covert to an extent, it has made what was a worthless planet of great value like all the rest so, but it has also made those who have (unaffordable by normal player) super high covert levels, have a extreme advantage, and due to not being able to mass with out being stopped by nox ,, which i still feel if your an aggressive player nox should not work for you , at least not at the same level as it does for peaceful players. Sorry cant give opinion of house bonus, but can give opinion of non house alliance bonus,, there is none so its unfair,
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

[-X lmao damn you sound like you think you think your jason, well your not and you dont control what his plans are, I have been informed by Forumthat he will give non house alliances a bonus one that will help those small players and just them. It is all to do with him coming up with a suitable bonus that helps the smaller player,,

and that is all i want,, to bad your so dang against it, What have you against smaller players?? have a better ability to play this game, to bad you have forgotten they are what keeps this game alive with out new players this game will die no matter what update you create.

sorry I did not mean to steer off the threads purpose ,
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

just a quick note to state the the whole point of this topic (started by me) is for you, the players, to provide feedback on the 'real life' effects of the updates, in the main live server, so we can addess imbalances or issues.
Is massing too expensive? Is sab too powerful? house bonus too strong, etc etc --- state it here, after trying it out, and we can address it. Will everyone be happy with everything? maybe not, but we will do our best to make the best decisions for the bulk of folks, and for the game overall.

so don't fret yet just opinionate....


Havent we already said that stuff enough? massing is far to expensive now, sab is slightly over powered, and since massing is as it is sabing is hell loads overpowered. Houses are screwed, good idea, not thought out well, still think its best if you just removed the bonuses and use it for empires to congregate. Killing a defence takes far too long and is pretty much deemed impossible with nox, also, killing a 10 bill defence with 1 trill takes even longer, it shouldnt and its been like that for too long. With this thread and the other combined there is probably 100 different ways to fix these issues.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

:-D :-D :-D nicely put we have went on long enough about all the issue, and the points have been made by way to many,,

what i would like to hear is your (Jason) suggestions on how you plan on fixing it, or is this the game we are stuck with.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

personally looking at it i would say the weapon decay is way to strong. Sabotage is strong too, but its mostly the weapon decay.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Trying to figure out why people are saying sabotage is too strong. If you're on crit/nox the most someone can sab you is 25 times before nox can kick in. You will still be left with 36% of your weapons at that point. Only one more sab can be made against you every hour due to the recovery rate of the nox turns against you.

My question for admin is about the calculations page...
Sabotage Damage Calculation: Your Covert Action minus their covert action (adjusted by their defcon rate) to a maximum of 5900 weapon power, or 2 percent of their total weapon power -whichever is greater. This is doubled if both parties are at war. The damage goes from lowest strength weapons, upwards, destroying as many as possible until you have no damage potential left, or your damage potential left is smaller than the strength of the next weapon.


Is this still true or has the value changed to reflect the highest current weapon value of 5760?
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Forum wrote:just a quick note to state the the whole point of this topic (started by me) is for you, the players, to provide feedback on the 'real life' effects of the updates, in the main live server, so we can addess imbalances or issues.
Is massing too expensive? Is sab too powerful? house bonus too strong, etc etc --- state it here, after trying it out, and we can address it. Will everyone be happy with everything? maybe not, but we will do our best to make the best decisions for the bulk of folks, and for the game overall.

so don't fret yet :) just opinionate....



Massing is just right, so you cant 0 someones defense in 1 go, all that means is, you cannot mass someone into the ground while they are offline, as if the player was online you wouldnt 0 them anyway, so this update did hurt all the players that will wait until someone is offline to mass them rather than take them out in an online battle, i never once seen some of these people complaining its to expensive now, when they could mass a defense down with little to no losses, saying it was to cheap, nuff said.

Sabbing is about spot on, had the game moved correctly 3 years ago we would have been at this point, the problem now is some who preferred to use 2000 x 1AT to mass someone down can be easily sabbed out now because they havent invested in there covert level, this update also hammered snipers into the ground, the 4% i think is fine, but it may need some tweaking as i have seen some people say they sabbed out an entire 10trill defense, maybe make it that as your doing more damage on sab now, increase it to 5% max weapons, but lose 10-15% covert agents on sab, instead of the current 5% ((( waits for the crying to begin ))) this would make sabbing as expensive as massing in the long run.


Houses, i still think that houses should have been just a way to group alliances into Empires, rather than bonus.

3AT rule great, it doesnt stop some people using 800 x 3 AT's but its something, at least its stopped the 2000 x 1 AT take no damage snipers.

All of these updates would have come in eventually had the game been updated as it grew, if it had been done back when it should have been done, you wouldnt have so many over 500mill armies, or long drawn out boring wars, its only because its sudden, and you have all been used to it being so easy for far to long that some dont like it.

I still believe perg should be set that you can only enter there twice per year, then you are removed for 6 months, its way to easy for someone to sit in there in the top 100 getting the GnR then ascend, without ever having to worry.
Last edited by GeneralChaos on Tue Jul 20, 2010 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

GeneralChaos wrote:Sabbing is about spot on, had the game moved correctly 3 years ago we would have been at this point, the problem now is some who preferred to use 2000 x 1AT to mass someone down can be easily sabbed out now because they havent invested in there covert level, this update also hammered snipers into the ground, the 4% i think is fine, but it may need some tweaking as i have seen some people say they sabbed out an entire 10trill defense, maybe make it that as your doing more damage on sab now, increase it to 5% max weapons, but lose 20-25% covert agents on sab ((( waits for the crying to begin )))

Once people start realizing they need to also train spies for defense, then the saboteurs will start taking on heavier losses. I think it's still too early to jump the gun and say we should lose 20-25% spies on a successful mission. I've done some sabbing and when the target actually trains spies, it gets to be very costly.

I definitely agree that too many people had it way too easy for too long. There is no way someone should be able to mass an entire alliance within one turn change... let alone mass one player without using technique.
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

Thee really isn't a problem with sabbing, it's generally the people defending against it.

I have done a LOT of sabbing this week, and on numerous occasions, as I am sabbing away a def people go an buy attack weapons, which just means I'll get their def weps quicker lol
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

i dont really mind the sabbing so much, its a bit powerful, but not drastic, I agree it really makes a difference when you have the covert levels. So really it makes people invest more into there account, nothing wrong there.
Weapon decay though is to strong, it needs some adjusting. Im not saying make it possible to mass an entire alliance in one night, but its so strong that even a 100b defense takes 30mins+ which is beyond rediculious. Personally id like to see nox back to its intention at the update, but to many cried about that heh...
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Re: July 29th 2010 -- look at all updates for balance/benefit

I was thinking ahead, it can be tweaked, only 3 people have really commented on the sabbing, id rather leave it where it was to be honest,

5% isnt alot when someone has low stats, but get someone with a covert and 5% of 10,000,000 starts to add up really fast.

Im all for leaving it has it is, in the event that it can always be looked at later, which isnt always a bad thing.
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