thank God for NATO!

[RepliMagni]

Meh, I believe we got some good deals on oil. So yeah, we win

[[KMA]Avenger]

Except that Gadaffi was a threat to places outside his borders in a myriad of different ways, from turning a blind eye to terrorists using Libya as a port to actively engaging with them.

So by your own logic KMA, it was valid for us to do something about it

Then it's down to the west to tell Gadaffi that he either deals with it or ask us for help to eradicate terrorist recruiters and bases in his country. if enough UN members told Gadaffi to do it he would have done it, you don't stay in power 40+ years by being stupid.

Look, lets take China, China is guilty or far more humanitarian atrocities than any other current dictatorship...why don't western backed NATO forces launch a bombing campaign and arm the freedom fighters over there as well, why do western leaders heap so much praise on what is obviously a far worse regime??

As i said, it's not our problem to go round the world as policeman, and we sure cant afford it anymore.


BTW, have you guys seen all the drum beating about Iran lately? apparently, troops are amassing in Kuwait, and now Barry Soetoro has stated that US troops (NOT the 100K contractors) will be out of Iraq by years end...could it be to have them go into Iran?!

[[KMA]Avenger]

http://www.infowars.com/madsen-gaddafi- ... en-killed/

If this is true that he was killed while flying the white flag, well all i can say is that NATO, the US and it's allies, and the rebels need to be brought up on charges of war crimes. the white flag goes back i think at least 2000 years, i know it was used during the Roman Empire era, and without checking, i think goes all the way to the Chinese. either way, this is absolutely disgusting and unforgivable that you cannot even give up under the protection of the white flag which has been internationally recognised i think in the late 1800's and again in the early 1900's...even the Russians during the height of WW2 did not do this when German atrocity's far outweighed anything Gadaffi has done....

Welcome to the NWO!

[Legendary Apophis]

Any reliable source on the matter?

Edit: the case is currently unclear whether it's true or not, as states the article from BBC-Sri Lanka

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sinhala/news/story ... _hrw.shtml

[[KMA]Avenger]

I actually got that from Wayne Madsen's website. Wayne Madsen is a geopolitical and intelligence specialist investigative reporter with contacts in the highest places of US and foreign Govts. the man is an impeccable source, and if he's linked to that article on Alex Jones website, well i trust what he says is 100% accurate.
It's the first link under "international news".
http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

I wouldn't trust the Beeb to report any of this.

There's also this interview that Wayne Madsen Gave the AJ show yesterday. skip to 13 mins and 30 seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCFwl0wfLYI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iX09vNi ... ideo_title

[Legendary Apophis]

These sources usually take as a given unverified information, rumors and half-truth. That's why I don't rely on them, claiming something even before it is verified or not.
When mainstream medias do it, and afterwards its found out they did, they get criticized heavily and lose bits of their reputation. However, these "alternate" sources don't have a reputation to hold so it doesn't matter if they bring any kind of "news" whether it's rumor, half-truth, unverified or still-not-proven.

[[KMA]Avenger]

Oh come on Jim, look at the mans bio, he's a source of the highest quality who has genuine sources and never reports half truths.

As for the mainstream, remember Abu-Ghraib? (if not go read about the atrocities and macabre torture committed by US troops under orders from the higher ups in the chain of command). that story broke first on the alternative media and was forced into the mainstream news.
Abu-Ghraib is not an isolated case, there have been many examples of stories forced into the mainstream, so i am sure you can understand my reluctance to trust the mainstream to break such news.

Edit, besides, what will you say IF in say a few weeks/months/years it comes out this story is true, these sources are still not trustworthy?

Edit2: Wayne Madsen's bio:

Wayne Madsen Biography:

Wayne Madsen is a Washington, DC-based investigative journalist, author and syndicated columnist. He has written for The Village Voice, The Progressive, Counterpunch, Online Journal, CorpWatch, Multinational Monitor, News Insider, In These Times, and The American Conservative. His columns have appeared in The Miami Herald, Houston Chronicle, Philadelphia Inquirer, Columbus Dispatch, Sacramento Bee, and Atlanta Journal-Constitution, among others.

Madsen is the author of The Handbook of Personal Data Protection (London: Macmillan, 1992), an acclaimed reference book on international data protection law; Genocide and Covert Operations in Africa 1993-1999 (Edwin Mellen Press, 1999); co-author of America's Nightmare: The Presidency of George Bush II (Dandelion, 2003); author of Jaded Tasks: Big Oil, Black Ops & Brass Plates and Overthrow a Fascist Regime on $15 a Day.

Madsen is a regular contributor on Russia Today. He has been a frequent political and national security commentator on Fox News and has also appeared on ABC, NBC, CBS, PBS, CNN, BBC, Al Jazeera, and MS-NBC. Madsen has taken on Bill O'Reilly and Sean Hannity on their television shows. He has been invited to testify as a witness before the US House of Representatives, the UN Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda, and an terrorism investigation panel of the French government.

Madsen has some twenty years experience in security issues. As a U.S. Naval Officer, he managed one of the first computer security programs for the U.S. Navy. He subsequently worked for the National Security Agency, the Naval Data Automation Command, Department of State, RCA Corporation, and Computer Sciences Corporation. Madsen was a Senior Fellow for the Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC), a privacy public advocacy organization.

Madsen is a member of the Society of Professional Journalists (SPJ) and the National Press Club.


Not good enough for you?

[Kit-Fox]

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[[KMA]Avenger]

I know mate. while a white flag might not have any legal standing, it is recognised as an honourable agreement fora truce, surrender or to negotiate a surrender...under such condition it is considered a war crime to kill people trying to surrender or negotiate a surrender.

Edit:
The white flag is an internationally recognized protective sign of truce or ceasefire, and request for negotiation. It is also used to symbolize surrender, since it is often the weaker military party which requests negotiation. A white flag signifies to all that an approaching negotiator is unarmed, with an intent to surrender or a desire to communicate. Persons carrying or waving a white flag are not to be fired upon, nor are they allowed to open fire. The use of the flag to surrender is included in the Hague Convention.



This is taken from Laws of War :
Laws and Customs of War on Land (Hague II); July 29, 1899


CHAPTER III -- On Flags of Truce
Article 32

"An individual is considered a parlementaire who is authorized by one of the belligerents to enter into communication with the other, and who carries a white flag. He has a right to inviolability, as well as the trumpeter, bugler, or drummer, the flag-bearer, and the interpreter who may accompany him.".

That was agreed upon by all the major or super powers of the time, including of all nations, Germany.

Probably the most brutal of all regimes during WW2 was Japan...even then i cannot find a single instance of the Japanese killing people waving/bearing the white flag.

[Kit-Fox]

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[Kit-Fox]

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