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Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 1:31 am
by Cole
Jack wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:Out of parties talks for a little bit in this post, I'm curious to know who is the other person who voted no in the poll. Come on, show your views openly!
It's a semi debate topic, and if you vote no or other kind of EU, you are expected to post as well! (if you vote yes, it's up to you, but preferable to post to show interested people your views etc)
Why only those that do not agree with you have to post?
1.Read again, I said it would be good if yes voters posted as well.
2.Because they don't share same opinion..
It's important to know what your adversary/opponent/competitor whatever thinks about EU.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 3:51 am
by Fear Of The Duck
LegendaryApophis wrote: I'm curious to know who is the other person who voted no in the poll.
so who's the first?
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 3:58 am
by Cole
Corran Horn wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote: I'm curious to know who is the other person who voted no in the poll.
so who's the first?
Q MAN wrote:*slowly raises hand from the back of the room*
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 2:07 pm
by Kit-Fox
Hardly suprising its a frenchman who is against pple who are against the EU, after all how much money have the french conned out of the EU that they dont deserve?? Oh yeah millions!
While countries like the brits pay some of the highest 'tithes' into it & get essentailly nothing back, bloody typical isnt it!
Serisously the EU as a political body is moribund and quite rightly so, its a disgrace and trying to unify europe will never work by any means as its component people are just to different, that you cant see that show you havent learnt from history at all.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 2:49 pm
by Cole
Kit-Fox wrote:Hardly suprising its a frenchman who is against pple who are against the EU, after all how much money have the french conned out of the EU that they dont deserve?? Oh yeah millions!
While countries like the brits pay some of the highest 'tithes' into it & get essentailly nothing back, bloody typical isnt it!
Serisously the EU as a political body is moribund and quite rightly so, its a disgrace and trying to unify europe will never work by any means as its component people are just to different, that you cant see that show you havent learnt from history at all.
You are VERY funny with bs you speak.
I don't think it's French government playing weather vane with EU.
We funded EU along with Lux, NL, W Germany, Italy & Belgium.
You however joined lately and play pro-euro when it benefits you lol.. (I have nothing against UK, just can't stand people saying bs like this)
Fortunately not every european thinks like you, fortunately oh yeaaah!
Yes because we are different it means we have to live seperated...and it's me who didn't learn? Are you serious dude? (your opinions fit quite well with your anti EU speech).
Seriously whenever I read such posts, my pro-EU position always rise even more towards 100% pro-EU feelings.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 3:34 pm
by Kit-Fox
its not BS, if it werent for our rebates for years we would have been paying the most into the Eu while getting very little in return. in fact the only other country that has put the same amount of cash into the EU is germany.
just been in the EU longer doesnt mean you've put more into it you know, try looking it up, you'll be suprised
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 3:41 pm
by Cole
Francois Mitterand was one of maker of Maastricht treaty...so yes, France participated in EU!
M. Giscard d'Estaing (former french president) was one of those who made Euro Constitution.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 5:01 pm
by Kit-Fox
LegendaryApophis wrote:Francois Mitterand was one of maker of Maastricht treaty...so yes, France participated in EU!
M. Giscard d'Estaing (former french president) was one of those who made Euro Constitution.
I tihnk you missed my point there with that response.
I was saying that out of all the countries in the EU currently, looked at on a country by country basis the two biggest 'investors' into the EU (those who have poured in the most cash) are Germany & the UK. And if it wasnt for the rebate the UK gets back from the EU then even Germany wouldnt count as a large contributor.
The UK has been bled dry not just by the EU but by other similar 'alliances' and to put not to finer a point on it, we're sick of it (well the people are anyways)
We know full well what our membership in the EU has cost us thank you very much and it wasnt worth it, we would have been better served continuing with our own commonwealth trade rather than allowing you lot (and special vrtiriol goes out to the french on this as they were one of the countries that pushed for the UK to stop trading with the commonwealth when we joined the EEC) to stop us.
The UK does and has never needed the EU (we dont need teh US either but thats another matter). We can thank you very much manage on our own and dont need your help/assistance or whatever else you may call your blatent interferance with our country, so why dont you if you want the EU to succeed stick to making one out of the countries that really want it, instead of having to con people into joining what was purely a trade aliiance only for it to change into a political alliance without any public debate or choice in the matter.
Go home & leave us alone, we dont like you, want you or need you thank you very much, we aprreciate the offer but bugger off.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 5:18 pm
by Cole
Kit-Fox wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:Francois Mitterand was one of maker of Maastricht treaty...so yes, France participated in EU!
M. Giscard d'Estaing (former french president) was one of those who made Euro Constitution.
I tihnk you missed my point there with that response.
I was saying that out of all the countries in the EU currently, looked at on a country by country basis the two biggest 'investors' into the EU (those who have poured in the most cash) are Germany & the UK. And if it wasnt for the rebate the UK gets back from the EU then even Germany wouldnt count as a large contributor.
The UK has been bled dry not just by the EU but by other similar 'alliances' and to put not to finer a point on it, we're sick of it (well the people are anyways)
We know full well what our membership in the EU has cost us thank you very much and it wasnt worth it, we would have been better served continuing with our own commonwealth trade rather than allowing you lot (and special vrtiriol goes out to the french on this as they were one of the countries that pushed for the UK to stop trading with the commonwealth when we joined the EEC) to stop us.
The UK does and has never needed the EU (we dont need teh US either but thats another matter). We can thank you very much manage on our own and dont need your help/assistance or whatever else you may call your blatent interferance with our country, so why dont you if you want the EU to succeed stick to making one out of the countries that really want it, instead of having to con people into joining what was purely a trade aliiance only for it to change into a political alliance without any public debate or choice in the matter.
Go home & leave us alone, we dont like you, want you or need you thank you very much, we aprreciate the offer but bugger off.
Join EU, then moan & complain, how typical/hypocritical...
It wasn't all for you? Awww...that's really sad isn't it? Now you don't like us for this, that's touching (not really
)
Weather **Filtered** alert!!!
All I see there is waahh waahh waahh...I will have several crocodile tears for ya .
I really feel anti european after reading your post, never could have expected such radical change happening so quick, I feel I will start a new party to fight together the infamy of EU's tyranny..[/heavy sarcasm]
Don't worry same feeling shared towards you anti europeans, from pro europeans like me!
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 6:32 pm
by Kit-Fox
wow with such rebuttals one wonders why you bothered to ask in the first place.
the UK especially was conned into joining the EU. We didnt want to join any political alliance and france etc etc knew this, hence why it was only a trade alliacne to start with (the EEC)
If joining europe is such a great idea why do you need to con people into it?
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 7:50 pm
by Desert Ghost
LegendaryApophis wrote:Desert Ghost wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:Universe wrote:Radical Right To Parliament!
There's already enough of them...(there shouldn't be
any >_<)
And also enough of their bs about holocaust being a minor detail in history, like if attempt of extermination of Jews was close to nothing.
HMMMM
Yes?
I'm against radical right (and left...) in office, because only so called progress they can achieve is a disbanding/exploding of EU...
So whoever supports them to be in office are AGAINST EU!! (just listen to far right/left leaders and how they feel about EU!)
And yes I know what I'm talking about, I'm informing myself for EU elections to be sure to know all facts, which I'm tending towards.
And yes what I said comes +/- from French far right leader...who has a sit in European Parliament. It's not lies, it's true.
man, im jewish... lol i know where it can get...
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 8:22 pm
by Solus
LegendaryApophis wrote:1.Read again, I said it would be good if yes voters posted as well.
actually pops you clearly said that your opponents in this 'debate' are EXPECTED to post their opinions, whereas people who agree with you are not.
LegendaryApophis wrote:...if you vote no or other kind of EU, you are expected to post as well!...
LegendaryApophis wrote:...if you vote yes, it's up to you...
besides, if this is to be a debate, then why dont you adress the issues Kit-fox has presented with something other than vague sarcasm which really doesnt accomplish anything?
~soul
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 12:34 am
by Cole
Kit-Fox wrote:wow with such rebuttals one wonders why you bothered to ask in the first place.
the UK especially was conned into joining the EU. We didnt want to join any political alliance and france etc etc knew this, hence why it was only a trade alliacne to start with (the EEC)
If joining europe is such a great idea why do you need to con people into it?
If I'm reacting like that, it's because the "it was all a conspiracy to trap us into your mastermind plan" is quite boring and false.
And if you knew as you pretend about EU, you would know it was constructed as time passed. There was no set and known goal of EU and euro money plans when Roma treaty was signed. It's not NWO crap planned hundred of years ago or whatever....
V.O.I.D wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:1.Read again, I said it would be good if yes voters posted as well.
actually pops you clearly said that your opponents in this 'debate' are EXPECTED to post their opinions, whereas people who agree with you are not.
LegendaryApophis wrote:...if you vote no or other kind of EU, you are expected to post as well!...
LegendaryApophis wrote:...if you vote yes, it's up to you...
besides, if this is to be a debate, then why dont you adress the issues Kit-fox has presented with something other than vague sarcasm which really doesnt accomplish anything?
~soul
The power of quotes...you can use them as you wish. And change their meaning. I'm seing you did so.
And yes sarcasm, because he doesn't seem to understand that EU built itself with time, that trapping countries into it with lies & hidden agenda is pure bs and is paranoia.
UK joined in 1973, Maastricht treaty in 1992...
It's just trying to make EU guilty for UK's SO CALLED mistake to have joined EU by pretending false things.
Desert Ghost wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:Desert Ghost wrote:LegendaryApophis wrote:Universe wrote:Radical Right To Parliament!
There's already enough of them...(there shouldn't be
any >_<)
And also enough of their bs about holocaust being a minor detail in history, like if attempt of extermination of Jews was close to nothing.
HMMMM
Yes?
I'm against radical right (and left...) in office, because only so called progress they can achieve is a disbanding/exploding of EU...
So whoever supports them to be in office are AGAINST EU!! (just listen to far right/left leaders and how they feel about EU!)
And yes I know what I'm talking about, I'm informing myself for EU elections to be sure to know all facts, which I'm tending towards.
And yes what I said comes +/- from French far right leader...who has a sit in European Parliament. It's not lies, it's true.
man, im jewish... lol i know where it can get...
I don't understand why people can say such things as "radical right to parliament" that it will do progress...
Do they even realize that all antisemit groups are either far right or far left? No, they just think far right is ultraliberal-capitalist...
That's where they are wrong. And I'm trying to tell those people here, but they don't want to understand.
They don't understand what enormeous mistake they could do if they voted for a radical party...why would right wing in several countries be hostile to far right? It's not because of their economical views, but for almost all the rest of their program, and more likely what can be read between the lines.
If you are racist/xenophob/antisemit, you will vote for far right. If you are capitalist and economically liberal, you will vote for right wing or those parties I don't agree with (libertarians), depending on your view of things. Am I generalizing? Of course not. I've considered suficiently the question.
That's why it really annoys me when people who aren't racist etc... want to vote for a radical side. They don't understand what their vote means.
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 1:23 am
by Fear Of The Duck
Kit-Fox wrote:wow with such rebuttals one wonders why you bothered to ask in the first place.
the UK especially was conned into joining the EU. We didnt want to join any political alliance and france etc etc knew this, hence why it was only a trade alliacne to start with (the EEC)
If joining europe is such a great idea why do you need to con people into it?
don't put all the blame on the french. it was british goverment who lied to their own ppl in order to get uk in the eu. eu is good for polititians, not for ppl of europe.
Jack wrote:It's clear that pops believes in the EU like a religion, it's why he demands that opposed to the EU post their reasons and does not really care if those in favor post their opinions or not.
aye. he sounds like one of those pro-eu muppets full of their eu bs who just keep repeating the same slogans over and over again and don't want to even REALLY listen to the other side. one my eastern-european co-workers said it's now with the eu like it was with the ussr 30 yrs ago. just the colour of the flag you are supposed to wave is different.
for everyone who wants to know the facts (especially for brits):
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Great-Deception ... 0826480144(i bet pops haven't read this)
Re: Let's not forget...[Europe only]
Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 3:59 am
by Kit-Fox
Its not pretending false things, even the founders of the EEC have publically stated that they created a trade only alliance to begin with becuase they knew some countries (the UK included) would not at that time joined a political alliance.
Hell they have come out and said it for gods sake. they knew damn well that if they had tried to create a political alliance to start with a lot of current EU countries would have turned around and said 'on your bike' when invited.
oh and dont forget you need the UK, we dont need you.
EDIT: I also see the the 'no EU' vote is winning, you might reflect on that