The bible

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Spacey
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Afentius wrote:Live-for-christ...edit out
That wasn't needed at all. Please stop.

The Xeno wrote:Now I do think we have drifted away from polite discussion...

I've been monitoring this thread, and noticed the same thing...which prompted me to post what I did. Alas King, you have found me out and called me on it... :roll:
Perhaps, I'll share my beliefs...but...this thread is quickly becoming negative space.
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Come_Forth
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I believe that the universe was created in the big bang and is 13.4 billion years old and that the earth is about 6.6 billion years old. I believe that life evolved. I do not see evidence for a God(s) but others do so I admit I could be wrong. The universe if fine tuned for life but I believe that life just evolved with what it had to work with. My big thing though is pain in the world and why a God(s) would need worship so bad. I was once a Christian though.

If you read my earlier post you will see that I have nothing against the Bible though. I think that it is a great piece of art. Proverbs is especially profound.
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There are some very valid points being raised on both sides, and this is a very interesting discussion. But please fellas (apologies to liv-4-christ if you aren't a fella, I don't know you yet!) try to keep it civil. I know it is something that you all feel passionate about, but rational posts make a better argument.
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Afentius
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Come_Forth[D12] wrote:I believe that the universe was created in the big bang and is 13.4 billion years old and that the earth is about 6.6 billion years old. I believe that life evolved. I do not see evidence for a God(s) but others do so I admit I could be wrong. The universe if fine tuned for life but I believe that life just evolved with what it had to work with. My big thing though is pain in the world and why a God(s) would need worship so bad. I was once a Christian though.

If you read my earlier post you will see that I have nothing against the Bible though. I think that it is a great piece of art. Proverbs is especially profound.


Tell me, then (And thanks for that clarifacation, I have nothing wrong with evolutionists, if thats what you call yourself, you do try to be rational)


how did the big bang start? Where did the matter come from? Something doesn't come out of nothing, its been proven over and over, and is common knowledge.
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Afentius
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Spacey wrote:
Afentius wrote:Live-for-christ...edit out
That wasn't needed at all. Please stop.

The Xeno wrote:Now I do think we have drifted away from polite discussion...

I've been monitoring this thread, and noticed the same thing...which prompted me to post what I did. Alas King, you have found me out and called me on it... :roll:
Perhaps, I'll share my beliefs...but...this thread is quickly becoming negative space.


appoligies, I was too harsh. However, I'll try to keep it nice in here :)
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Come_Forth
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I admit I have no answer on that. Maybe the universe was not created. I wish Hawking could figure it out :P


But I would ask where did God come from? At the end of the day I think it is easier to believe that the universe has always existed than that God has always existed but that is just my opinion.

Btw I do believe in evolution, but some days I can understand how people can be creationists by looking at the complex world we live in.
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Afentius
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I personally believe its 100x too complex for it to just "happen.." but yes, I choose to believe in a God, because the universe must have been created somehow!
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Come_Forth
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I believe that most people underestimate natural selection. Evolution is not random but is guided by survival.

Back to what others mentioned before, Christians believe that in the original form the Bible was without error but now it does since it has been translated and copied for thousands of years. I see no problem with believing that but why did not God fix the errors.
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Afentius
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Come_Forth[D12] wrote:I believe that most people underestimate natural selection. Evolution is not random but is guided by survival.

Back to what others mentioned before, Christians believe that in the original form the Bible was without error but now it does since it has been translated and copied for thousands of years. I see no problem with believing that but why did not God fix the errors.


where do you have proof that he didn't fix them?

also, I can find not one example anywere in this universe where information was ADDED to dna, it just doesn't happen

and I'm off for the night:) Peace
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Come_Forth
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Typos in the Bible etc I will show you once you wake up tomorrow.

What about a virus, it will become immune to the medicine after several generations. Natural selection.
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Christians believe that in the original form the Bible was without error but now it does since it has been translated and copied for thousands of years. I see no problem with believing that but why did not God fix the errors.

Not all Christians. Remember, we have had a checkered past.
Starting with Orthodoxy, then the schism and the Catholic denomination, which then splits into the Lutheran and protestant denominations, which now are splitting into reformist groups and etc.

Each new denomination tends to add and subtract from what has gone before. I would caution you therefore, not to take one denomination as the spokesperson for the religion... the same with Islam or the Jewish faith.

==========
For instance, I would be very hesitant to claim the Bible as the be-all-end-all answer key. Whereas I would imagine many of the protestant groups would gladly hold it up as the sole source of truth.

In answer to the question, I would humbly suggest that God has no reason to fix the errors, the Truth is there, the translations are out there, the history is out there.

Only about 30% of the world's pop is Christian so 70% will burn forever, it is random chance that you ended up with the family/religion you did.

Again, I would believe the answer would depend upon whom you ask.
The God I believe in has once before sent his son into hell to save those who had not heard the word. Perhaps he will do the same at the end times.
Certainly, those who have not heard will not be automatically cast down as they are in the Quaran: blinded by Allah and destined to hell. Further, Orthodoxy does not prescribe to once-saved-always-saved, and so it’s only reasonable to allow morality and not gilt-crosses to be the key to heaven; more hope for those who never hear of christianity.


What about a virus, it will become immune to the medicine after several generations. Natural selection.

I know it's old, but I thoroughly enjoyed Isaac Assimov's explanation of the primordial sea and the formation of life therein. Granted, I found him making inexplicable leaps from non-life to life, and I believe my issues were based on (one of ) the current creationist arguments (?) against evolution.
It is not so much directed at natural selection, it accepts that as given; but instead focus' on the limited amount of selection that can take place before a positive mutation is required to expand the gene pool.

Ergo, a Jack Russell Terrier may become a Mastif, but will never become a cow without a positive mutation. The problem arises with the lack of positive mutations.
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Come_Forth
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I used to be a very conservative (Protestant) Christian so that is mainly what I know lol.

Ah just let natural selection screw around for a few billion years, look what it has done in a few thousand!
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Heh, I was Episcopalian from a Baptist line before converting :P
Icons and souvlaki were quite an interesting shift, along with the theological changes. :D
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???

wow what fun debate the never ending one. Well now that i am here there is a few questions i woudl like to ask the people whom believe in god.

1. If god created the world in 7 days on what day did he create and kill the dinosaurs. and why ?

2. If god created man in his own image why was woman supposedly made second and how much of the bible was written by a woman ?

3. IF mary was a virgin did she have a husband?

all of those are serious Questions that i would like to know about thanks
Afentius
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??? wrote:wow what fun debate the never ending one. Well now that i am here there is a few questions i woudl like to ask the people whom believe in god.

1. If god created the world in 7 days on what day did he create and kill the dinosaurs. and why ?

2. If god created man in his own image why was woman supposedly made second and how much of the bible was written by a woman ?

3. IF mary was a virgin did she have a husband?

all of those are serious Questions that i would like to know about thanks


God created the world in 7 days, creating the dinosaurs along with other mammels. He didn't kill them, after the flood, they couldn't cope with the radical climate change...

how much was written by a woman? As far as I know none... and God created Man in his own image, not woman, although I'd like xeno to clarify on that topic....

she was a virgin yes, but when Joseph found she was, an angel came to him and told him that God concieved her, and to marry her, and he did.

hope it helped

peace
-Michael
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