Complaining about Homer

[Spacey]

This is my personal opinion, and I'll explain why I feel this way after:

The IRC mods/ops/whatever do a good job. If not good than great job.

I say that not as a mod but as someone who was on IRC back in 2005/early 06.

I got kicked twice from IRC, and I came back twice (after each kick).

I masked a bad word and was kicked... we were talking about G.W. Bush.
I came back asking what happened. Found out I broke a rule. Apologized, and asked what other rules there were.
Then I posted a link that was to a video about Bush, and had a bad word in the title.... it was/is a great video too.
I was kicked again, and told that if I did it again I would be banned.
I apologized again (I forgot about the word in the link), and then signed off on my own accord.
I quit while I was ahead... not by much, but while I was still ahead.

The only time I went back to IRC was as a mod for the meetings. I learned the lesson and took the warnings for face value.

By me posting this I'm not passing judgement, but as that people consider possibilities, if one small thing had changed in what they did. What would have happened to me if I continued to violate the rule?

[LTC]

@the guy compaining about logs being old:

You want some new? I have plenty more, but i just went up through the log file.

But i dont have anything for the last two weeks.
And no, not because homer wasnt swearing, its cause i left irc.

[Harokai]

But if you are gonna pick on the use of "God" (which Paul has already said he has stopped using) find out which God he is "representing" or "calling himself" before you say that he is insulting your religion.

EDIT: Sorry if I sound a bit rude there. Just one of the things I hate are people saying something insult their religion when it may not even affect it.

It's not so much about defending my religion as such as it is about basic respect for knowing to some people it has meaning. If other people take offense to things they feel goes against the grain of what they believe I would expect them to speak up about it so that it can be worked through. This specifically however is something that was done with the knowledge that a number of people on irc is religious and is either Christian (me) or Muslim. It's also about expecting that ops will work to upholding a moral highground for the realization that different people have different values.

I know that I swear when speaking, mostly as expression but when I see it constantly from ops whom are suppossed to enforce their rules what is it supposed to say about the server in general? I've been around long enough to be able to say that they mostly do not listen to their own rules and act in the way they do when they feel it's suitable.

By me posting this I'm not passing judgement, but as that people consider possibilities, if one small thing had changed in what they did. What would have happened to me if I continued to violate the rule?

The problem is mostly that the ops do not uphold their own rules.

It's not too much of me to expect that they will stand for what the rules are and be fair about it. They don't however. The head op here doesn't even bother discussing with TLE what his problem is, he merely slanders our name in general conversation even in front of us and it's come since far before most of us have recently started acting up.

[noone]

This whole god thing is rather silly ....

I would guess the one offended by it prolly has a large discontent for the ascended server too .... full of gods there you know <.<

anywasyzzz entire sgw, sga, sgwhatever is intertwined with the relations to gods, false gods, gods here, gods there, .... gods everywhere ....

Rather silly to be offended by the word that 'could' define a diety.

[Harokai]

Within the context of the server and who Paul is it did not ever refer to an sgw god or a greek god, nor a roman god.

The point of what I was attempting to bring out about values has clearly not been grasped. The values spoken about does not only refer to religion but it refers to swearing as well as the way in which the ops run the server, their bias towards their own rules and their bias in treating people.

[hidden]

he could have been roleplaying

[Gatedialer]

God is NOT God's name.


Now, are you saying that he did it with the sole intent to insult, or that he had that for his name, and it insulted you?

And?

When the nick is used to mock someone, as spy said, it doesn't mean he can use it.

Anyway, the use of the nick "God" is not allowed, so the fact that Paul was using is essentially masking a banned nick.

God Erroneous Nickname: meh

[Zeratul]

that it isnt an allowed nick, makes it 99% certain that paul doesnt use it anymore...

[LTC]

[27.01]@[23:35:40] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> You will be farmed a lot more without a deff. :>
[27.01]@[23:35:56] <homer> is that a threat SuperJediJesusMuffinMan?
[27.01]@[23:35:59] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> Yes
[27.01]@[23:36:07] <wacky> lol
[27.01]@[23:36:07] <homer> lol
[27.01]@[23:36:19] <homer> do u want to come to chat ever again ?
[27.01]@[23:36:22] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> Oh, was that a counterthreat?
[27.01]@[23:36:25] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> hahahahha
[27.01]@[23:36:31] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> I guess it was
[27.01]@[23:36:49] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> Abusing oper power again, homer?
[27.01]@[23:36:57] <homer> damnr right i am
[27.01]@[23:37:04] <SuperJediJesusMuffinMan> Nothing new then
[27.01]@[23:37:13] <homer> whos gonna stiop me ?

[LTC]

";)"

[homer1475]

Anyone besides me notice its only the TLE empire complaining here ?

and no matter who runs irc people always complain about the people in power. If its not me then it was whitey, if not whitey is was agapooka on the forums, if its not pookie then its smoosh, if its not smoosh its the mods in general.
People allways complain when u strip them of the rights they should so think they deserve.

[homer1475]

sorry for the double post but whoever mods this section could either please lock it or move it to the chat section as its not a bug or non game related bug, nor is it a forum specific issue, or anything to do with the forum mods.

[Severian]

Anyone besides me notice its only the TLE empire complaining here ?

Anyone else notice the complaint was from a TLE person about an op provoking TL and then banning then and then that the Op slurs were at TLE as a whole and that the forceful break in was the TL channel to abuse a member of TL? Gee, I wonder why TLE are complaining...what a world.

...and no matter who runs irc people always complain about the people in power. If its not me then it was whitey, if not whitey is was agapooka on the forums, if its not pookie then its smoosh, if its not smoosh its the mods in general.
People allways complain when u strip them of the rights they should so think they deserve.

You complained about Whitey in power and now you're in power and people are complaining about you. Suddenly its not ok to complain? Strange really and kinda funny at the same time.

Just because your in power, that does not justify and vindicate your actions and give you free reign to do whatever you feel like without repercussions.

You chose as a top authority to not be unbiased and slur TLE. You chose to abuse your powers to BREAK into their channel for the sole purpose of a personal issue. You chose to ignore the issue at hand completely and utterly.

Infact, I believe inaction or the ability to admit there was a mistake or wrong doing was another thing you had accused Whitey of and now by purposely avoided all my posts and points, you are doing the exact same thing.

As for locking, Thats up to the OP to ask. For moving, not one of the ops felt necessary to ask it and now that you've thrown your opinion out, you want it moved/locked as the last say before more incriminating evidence is posted.

Well done mate, well done.

[Borek]

I'm not in TLE and i detest what you have done Homer, as i said in the thread stickied at the top of the general forum which has now mysteriously been completely deleted, not moved, not locked, but completely deleted. Why? Well, i can only assume it was because the thread made you Homer look like a complete tool and utterly vindicated TLE.

So lets sum it up for this thread:

TLE get provoked by Op's, insulted by Op's, other users on the "anti-TLE" side of the argument use some swearing and masking without penalty, TLE member uses 1 masked swear word and gets banned.

You Homer are a disgrace, if it was your own personal server and not SGW related then you can say and do what you want, but this is the SGW IRC, it's for the game, not for your own personal little pit of nepotism and ego stroking. if you can't handle TLE sticking up for themselves you are not fit to run the server, period.

[Xavier]

The flip side to every coin.

But wait, we haven't even gotten up to the op massings yet. On forums, people complain about users massing mods for doing their jobs. Yet on irc, a user makes a mistake and have gotten massed time and time again by - you guessed it, the ops. It has become embedded in the culture of irc that "n00bs" or people with the wrong attitude/breaking rules are massed and most of the massings have occured from a select few ops. Most of the time with enourmous size differences.

Completely unethical of course.

<JOS> you'll be glad to hear, Tim has left
<LordBalor>
<LordBalor> Its like christmas all over again!
<JOS> i know
<Silence> lmao
<Odin> lol
<Odin> christmas , estern and birthday on the same day
*** IIxFOXYxII has joined #stargatewars
<Silence> whats wrong with tim again?
<JOS> spammer
<JOS> immature
<JOS> bogan
<Odin> he is a pain in the neck
<JOS> etx
<Silence> ahok
<JOS> etc*
<Silence> fair enough
<Silence> thoughta massing him?
<JOS> he wont give us his ingame
<LordBalor> No one knows his ingame nick
<Silence> ahok
<Odin> thats the problem
* JOS slaps his forehead
<LordBalor> I know we'll all be willing to put in 5 bill for it

Hmm.

---

You used to get on fine with everyone in the channel and now suddenly you're trying to come across as some sort of perpetually oppressed chat user standing up for the rights of the underprivileged, when in fact they may or may not be idiots but clearly have not bothered themselves with so much as skim reading the rules.

We live in a free society; opinions are therefore free to have. However, if you feel they are insulting or offensive please talk to the channel and/or network staff.

You see, you will find that, being a chat room, people are allowed to voice their opinions. Freedom of speech I guess. Ops are not excluded from this by virtue of their position. They are allowed to have opinions as well. They can voice them regarding TLE should they choose, just as someone like Nuto would come in and rave about Omega in years gone by. These people were not censored or prevented from doing so, despite ops even being occasionally part of the alliances in question.

Did you have any issues with 'slurs' on Omega or other alliances for that matter?
Or is it only unacceptable because an op is doing it?

That would be double standards but certainly not in the way you describe.

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12 ops/mods posts have occured since I first posted the blatent abuse and all 12 have utterly ignored it in the hope it'll just fade away and be forgotten. It has not even been publically acknowledged, let alone countered.

Well let's give that a crack then shall we.

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1) [That modded is the F-bomb btw so leading by example on no swearing]

Fine. You have an example of homer swearing. You talk in your next point about how TLE was 'provoked' into swearing and how awful it was that they were kicked for doing so. This looks to me like a statement made when homer is well and truly provoked. So the question becomes; Is it ok to swear if you are provoked or not?

Make up your mind and let us know. Ta.

And yes I know there were a few older examples of him swearing presented. Those are from a time where the rules seemed to be swear, get an automatic kick from a bot and automatically rejoin the channel. Forgive Homer for not administering this punishment to himself.

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2) So much for Not offending people and for leaving politics behind.

Provoking people and then kick/banning them when they get angry and post something in the moment.

I've already talked about how everyone is entitled to their opinion. Certainly stating something like "TLE are just bullies / people who think they can do nehting" is not kick worthy and never has been. There has been an eternity of far worse remarks made about Omega in particular that never caused an issue. It is not an abuse of power for an op to express his opinion in the same way as a regular user.

If the TLE feels the comment is overly offensive and decides swearing at an op is the way to go, rather than counter arguing, so be it. You will find ops won't be kicking users making sound counter arguments in defense of their own alliance.

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3) Note: Part of the administrations removal of Whitey was apparent abuse of privacy. So much for respecting privacy and people's personal messages.

Right. Again, this has nothing to do with ops, or even irc for that matter. Anyone and everyone has the ability to copy and paste private conversations.

You are upset that quickshot showed homer what you said to him in private. That's understandable. It is likely, however, he would have done the same thing had he not been an op. Furthermore, it is not a kicking offense. Merely something that you may consider unethical as you felt the comments were of a personal nature.

Anywho, this is under the heading of "following protocol and blatenly breaking the rules". I just fail to see the relevance of this point to the overall argument. You confided in a friend, he repeated what you said to the highest power and did so with the best of intentions - Either his concern for a friend or his concern for the channel and a situation that you are escalating beyond belief.

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4) Note: Part of the administrations removal of Whitey was apparent abuse of Oper powers. Here we have a case of an oper, the highest authority on irc abusing his powers for a personal vendetta, breaching security, privacy and ban evasion.

So the whole purpose of this was a PERSONAL matter which homer used his opper powers to deal with. Breaks into our channel for the sole purposes of making a judgement call of me, threatens to post the PRIVATE messages and unfairly confronts me in my own alliance channel.

Unfairly confronts you in your own alliance channel. Here you are, bashing (or perhaps "making a judgement call of") a man that has worked tirelessly over a period of multiple years for you and people like you, on a public forum in front of the entire SGW community.

Way to show him.

You proceed to list of a number of courses of action that he could or should have taken.
Perhaps you should delete your posts and have a read yourself.

---

Old Horizon, New Faces.

You seem to have this running theme about how Homer is doing exactly what Whitey did that led ultimately to his removal. What rubbish.

The fact of the matter is that were Whitey as fair, reasonable or dedicated as Homer, he would never have been removed.