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personally, i think that materialism and vanity have replaced spirituality in the modern era as the dominating and driving forces in mankind's daily life which has had a very negative affect on our daily lives and the way we see the world and treat our world and each other.
i also believe that each and everyone of us has the ability to reach greater awareness, understanding and can evolve into a more powerful and enlightened being if it was not for the material things that hold us back.

i feel materialism blinds us to true reality and spirituality, is very negative and keeps us from experiencing all that life has to offer.

materialism keeps us from knowing who we are as a species and as individuals. i see materialism as the damn behind which is a whole new world of understanding that would rush through if we could break all the conventional thought conditioning...

those are my thoughts, what are yours?

no clue wat i said

http://www.xs4all.nl/~maartens/philosop ... _bees.html

Read the poem

with an increase in wealth comes an increase in materialism, religeon used to be what consoled the ego. Now that we're wealthier it's a bunch of flashy crap we think we need.

my god. I actually..unless I missed something as I scan read your post... agree with you for once Avenger.

dont be so shocked...you would agree more if only you understood my posts/topics


that aside, i found the first post a bit on t6he hard side to write. for me my posts make more sense in my head than on screen

[KMA]Avenger wrote:dont be so shocked...you would agree more if only you understood my posts/topics


that aside, i found the first post a bit on t6he hard side to write. for me my posts make more sense in my head than on screen

lol. I understand most of your topics better than yourself it generally seems, but we shal't argue over things like this.. if my general absence from discussion in this section has not taught you then allow me to briefly make the point I do not enter battles of wits in here with unarmed opponents. A commonly used saying indeed.. but one that fits the bill well in this circumstance.

battle?! who says i want to or have been engageing in battles of any kind?

regardless, the point is taken but not shared

[KMA]Avenger wrote:personally, i think that materialism and vanity have replaced spirituality in the modern era as the dominating and driving forces in mankind's daily life which has had a very negative affect on our daily lives and the way we see the world and treat our world and each other.
i also believe that each and everyone of us has the ability to reach greater awareness, understanding and can evolve into a more powerful and enlightened being if it was not for the material things that hold us back.

i feel materialism blinds us to true reality and spirituality, is very negative and keeps us from experiencing all that life has to offer.

materialism keeps us from knowing who we are as a species and as individuals. i see materialism as the damn behind which is a whole new world of understanding that would rush through if we could break all the conventional thought conditioning...

those are my thoughts, what are yours?

I agree with you, but I highly doubt that people value spirituality more than material goods. Perhaps I'm jaded now, but I doubt that anyone really cares about those things anymore. Yes, it looks nice on paper and reading about it, but I don't think people really care about those things anymore.

I think our choices keeps us from spirituality or knowing ourselves.

Spacey wrote:I think our choices keeps us from spirituality or knowing ourselves.

that's a very good point and one i should have considered from the outset.

[KMA]Avenger wrote:personally, i think that materialism and vanity have replaced spirituality in the modern era as the dominating and driving forces in mankind's daily life which has had a very negative affect on our daily lives and the way we see the world and treat our world and each other.
i also believe that each and everyone of us has the ability to reach greater awareness, understanding and can evolve into a more powerful and enlightened being if it was not for the material things that hold us back.

i feel materialism blinds us to true reality and spirituality, is very negative and keeps us from experiencing all that life has to offer.

materialism keeps us from knowing who we are as a species and as individuals. i see materialism as the damn behind which is a whole new world of understanding that would rush through if we could break all the conventional thought conditioning...

those are my thoughts, what are yours?

What makes you think that dedicating yourself to being more 'enlightened' would be any different then being dedicated to achieving your goals of material wants?

maybe the actual pursuit/dedication is the same, but the ends are by no means the same...

to use an analogy, just because 2 people are travelling north on the same road doesn't mean they'll end up at the same destination, that's the difference.

So....me buying my new flatscreen tv means I don't "know myself"?

If we got rid of all material goods, all commercialisation - the world economy would ground to a halt, there'd be no drive to further research, no ambition, no motivation, no new medicines, no great human endeavours.....vanity, pride, ambition, jealousy, envy......they are the driving force behind every great cultural/technological breakthrough.....how are we supposed to "evolve into a more powerful and enlightened being" by rejecting them?

A much more likely result would be widespread depression, apathy, and the degeneration of human civilisation......

I'm not saying a slight withdrawal from material culture would be a bad thing - commercialisation has gone too far (it is more socially acceptable to buy a new dvd than to give to charity)......but materialism isn't some great enemy, holding back humanity from ascending to some nirvana state.......

CRASSUS wrote:What makes you think that dedicating yourself to being more 'enlightened' would be any different then being dedicated to achieving your goals of material wants?

Perhaps acquiring large material wealth will make someone truly happy, but arguably the most important things in life cannot be purchased. By extension then, those things that are worth most cannot be gained through financial ends.

For me spirituality is a broad term used to refer to things from 'knowing yourself' (knowing who you are deep down inside) to someone valuing personal relationships over a car, house, or gaining material wealth (your 'spirit' as it were or as it's called... I'm not saying I agree with the notion of spirits).

I mean no the most important things in life can't be purchased, but what in the world makes you think that you cannot pursue wealth and power while also pursuing love and family? Most billionaires have wives and kids and a good life, hell the one billionaire i know has four wives.