Efficient growth

[Slim87R]

I was doing some math to the point that I got kind of lost so I can't really explain it, but I was trying to figure the ratio of income tech cost to UP cost to get the most efficient bang for my naq.

Here are some numbers:
Tech LVL: |Inc: |+Plus: |%Percent:
1015 1008122612 0 0
1016 1009026757 904145 0.0897
1017 1009930903 904146 0.0896
1018 1010835049 904146 0.0895

A turn happened while I was doing this, I made them miners inc up to 1011453035, did 1 more tech to bring it to 10123743174, +Plus 904698 at a cost of 373271319

I clicked the link to get 5 soldiers made them miners increasing my inc to 1012374317, +Plus per miner 3316.8. The next UP cost was 58542900

So at the top, per turn I would see a 0.2418% return on what I spent while at the bottom I would see a 0.0057% return per turn. This would be at a ratio of 42.42:1 tech cost to UP cost in the interest of pure income gain. I am not good at math, my head is spinning, I bet my bottom dollar I am wrong or not grasping something. Thoughts?

[HippyFool]

You were trying to work out a formula to see if it was better to buy UP (more units), or buy income techs (increased income), when considering maximizing current and future income?

In order to do this, you first must work out the formula for income. (the effect of UU and techs on income)

The income formula likely consists of income units having a base value (perhaps a value that has to be multiplied by ascension lvl). I think the value is close to 16.8 but I couldn't get it to work properly. Then you have to factor in techs, but I am not sure if techs work on income the same as other techs.

Formula would be something like: income units x (16.8 x ascension lvl) x ((techs + 100) / 100)

That isn't right though, as I couldn't make it work. Also, you have to factor in untrained units adding income...and also ascension units adding income. So you have to consider 3 separate types of units that all most likely have different base levels. Also, does the income tech affect only income units, or also UU and ascension units?

To simplify things, you really need an un-ascended account, with no techs, and also no UU and no ascension units and no income units. Then train income units 1 at a time and also do techs 1 at a time.

What I am really trying to say... Is ... good luck.

[Duderanch]

I don't have a NG account, I wasn't really planning on creating one but if someone wanted to get me on MSN id be willing to create an account and give you the data for base values of different things if it would help with a formula?

[Slim87R]

Nah, I don't really want to work it out. Not good enough with numbers. But thanks anyways.

[HippyFool]

I don't have a NG account, I wasn't really planning on creating one but if someone wanted to get me on MSN id be willing to create an account and give you the data for base values of different things if it would help with a formula?

Perhaps when I am done with my uni exams and have some time, I will take you up on that offer.

If you got bored and wanted to do it sooner... what we need to find out is exactly what single income units add to income when not affected by techs, and also how techs affect those units!

[raisdead]

I came up with

a= Ascension Level
u= Untrained Units
p= Ascension Helpers
i= Income Units
r=1.12 if income bonus from race
t=tech level

ar(1+.01t)(5u+10p+20i+floor(.05u+.1p+.2i))

Let me know if it works for you, as it works for me and I came up with it a few days ago.

[HippyFool]

I came up with

a= Ascension Level
u= Untrained Units
p= Ascension Helpers
i= Income Units
r=1.12 if income bonus from race
t=tech level

ar(1+.01t)(5u+10p+20i+floor(.05u+.1p+.2i))

Let me know if it works for you, as it works for me and I came up with it a few days ago.

... I think you are right, but I don't understand what floor means?

If I use: ar(1+.01t)(5u+10p+20i) ... I get 376,799,850 which is damn close to my real income of 380,567,808, so I am guessing you are correct.

So yeah... what is floor?

[raisdead]

floor is the largest integer not greater than value, conceptually just drop all the decimals.

floor(1.9)=1
floor(2.1)=2

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floor_and_ ... _functions

[HippyFool]

floor is the largest integer not greater than value, conceptually just drop all the decimals.

floor(1.9)=1
floor(2.1)=2

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floor_and_ ... _functions

Hmm ok I get that... not quite sure how to use it in the formula. You're making me feel maths-retarded

I am going to be a lazy bum and give you my numbers and ask you to substitute them into the formula for me so I can see it

a 18
u 388
p 48000
i 92230
r (not income race)
t 800

My income is currently: 380,668,410

EDIT: Can it be done in excel? my formula was like this:

=B1*(1+0.01*B6)*(5*B2+10*B3+20*B4+FLOOR(0.05*B2+0.1*B3+0.2*B4))

But it gave me an error message: "You've entered too few arguments for this function."

[Slim87R]

So can that be used to determine the ratio of UP cost to income tech cost to get the best income growth?

[raisdead]

Excel? Of Course! I don't use excel, but if I remember correctly your need to do something like

=B1*(1+0.01*B6)*(5*B2+10*B3+20*B4+FLOOR(0.05*B2+0.1*B3+0.2*B4,1))

Notice the ,1 in the floor function.

Don't worry about feeling like a math retard, you probably aren't. floor and ceil are "unimportant" for math classes to teach...

[HippyFool]

Excel? Of Course! I don't use excel, but if I remember correctly your need to do something like

=B1*(1+0.01*B6)*(5*B2+10*B3+20*B4+FLOOR(0.05*B2+0.1*B3+0.2*B4,1))

Notice the ,1 in the floor function.

Don't worry about feeling like a math retard, you probably aren't. floor and ceil are "unimportant" for math classes to teach...

Ohhhh... You are my new best friend! Formula works perfectly, thankyou!

[Juliette]

What in the name of all that is holy and worthy of praise is that?!

*glares* What does that do.. it calculates income, right?
I am interested in whether you can make it do what **Filtered** mentioned;

[Come up with ]a formula to see if it [is] better to buy UP (more units), or buy income techs (increased income), when considering maximizing current and future income?

*grin* If you can pull that one off, you will be a good friend of mine too, master Raisdead.


(Additionally, if you can - and I actually think you could - it means we will need to consider taking anti-automation measures - as a formula guiding 'spending decisions' is a big part of proper automation - but that is a different story.)

[raisdead]

(Additionally, if you can - and I actually think you could - it means we will need to consider taking anti-automation measures - as a formula guiding 'spending decisions' is a big part of proper automation - but that is a different story.)

Is that reason, not to share my result or not to do it ;-)

If it is suites the jury I won't solve a reduced form of the game, that is, if it violates the rules or the powers that be decide it would cause too much harm.