reality debate?

[Phlamingoe]

The best way to explain it that I can think of is to use the example of driving a car. When you're driving down the street at whatever speed, and pass a house, from the house's perspective you are moving, from your perspective, the house is moving.

I hope that clears something up....

guess who
that's the part i know.. so it doesn't clear much. sorry.

What I mean is, just because something appears to be moving, doesn't mean it is.

[Fear Of The Duck]

but everything is in motion

[Phlamingoe]

Yes, everything is in motion, but that really has nothing to do with time going faster or slower. It would take me a few hours to explain all the concepts you need to understand in order to understand time dialation, and unfortunatly I am no teacher, so you probably wouldn't get it anyway.

Let wiki do the work, start your research with an Introduction to General Relativity

[Fear Of The Duck]

ok. now i understand why clocks in space are slower.

but this explains the main problem.

[Phlamingoe]

ok. now i understand why clocks in space are slower.

but this explains the main problem.

Makes sense to me

[Fear Of The Duck]

but still doesn't explain the case with ships. something there is wrong and i wanna learn what!!!!

[Phlamingoe]

What is wrong with the ship?

[Fear Of The Duck]

ya're traveling at the speed of light (c) in a spaceship and know there's other spaceship traveling at the speed c and ya'ra gonna crash into it if ya don't do anything.

so ya need to destroy the other ship with a laser beam (the red line). laser is a light so it travels at the speed c.

fig2.jpeg

what happens?

from your point of view the laser beam "escapes" forward from the barrel of yer gun at the speed c and will destroy the incoming ship (the speed of light in a vacuum is the same for all observers, regardless of their relative motion or of the motion of the source of the light)

fig3.jpeg

but from the other ship's point of view both you and your laser reach it at the same time.

fig4.jpeg

so:
from yers point of view they are dead, ya're alive.
from theirs point of view they are dead, so are you.

so??


the universe colapses... ???

it just can't be like that, so there has to be a mistake in this reasoning. i think it has something to do with that laser beam, just i'm not smart enough to see what's wrong.

[Phlamingoe]

Well there's your problem! Lasers can't blow things up! But assuming they could...

Lets see....You know how if you drop a ball from a car traveling 60 MPH, the ball will drop straight down next to the car? Since the ball is already going 60 MPH.

So, I'm going to assume that when you fire the laser (since its attached to the ship) its already going light speed, so its going to accelerate PAST light speed once fired?

So the laser is going C+(speed of a laser fired from 0 MPH)

[Fear Of The Duck]

that's impossible. ya're thinking newtonian, while ya should be thinkin relative.

[Spacey]

Lets see....You know how if you drop a ball from a car traveling 60 MPH, the ball will drop straight down next to the car? Since the ball is already going 60 MPH.

Not true, unless you are saying there is not resistance due to wind.

When you are driving down the highway at 100, or a street at 60 ask your passenger to throw a tennis ball directly ball into the air... see what happens. Make sure there is no one behind you before you attempt this.

I can't really remember my high school physics, and barely my university physics, but there is a condition where the tennis ball needs to be thrown in front of you to be able to catch it.

[The Xeno]

^
Indeed.

When you are driving down the highway at 100

*pulls off the highway ASAP*
:mumble: crazy high-speed drivers ruining the road with their arsenal of tennis balls :mumble:

ya're traveling at the speed of light (c) in a spaceship and know there's other spaceship traveling at the speed c and ya'ra gonna crash into it if ya don't do anything.

I have always understood that you cannot reach the speed of light... as the necessary force to achieve further acceleration continues to increase exponentially into infinity as your mass balloons.
Afaik then, no matter how close you come to C, you will never reach it - while your laser beam is C and thus will blow up the opposing spaceship.

Now, if we can in fact reach C... I would expect a crash, as you cannot accelerate light (afaik) - and would in fact be flying at the same speed as your beam, which would probably get suspended in your 'barrel'.

So, I'm going to assume that when you fire the laser (since its attached to the ship) its already going light speed, so its going to accelerate PAST light speed once fired?

Light/lasers does not work like ballistics, else shining a flashlight while running would put the beam 'over' light speed. Now, if there was no resistance and you fired a ballistic projectile from a spaceship - then you could add the thrust to the current speed - though remember, 15lb's thrust at 20mph is a far cry from 15lbs thrust at just under lightspeed (in theory)

[Phoenix of Terra]

Xeno has spoken!

Spacey, please tell me your talking 100 kph.

[Spacey]

^
Indeed.

When you are driving down the highway at 100

*pulls off the highway ASAP*
:mumble: crazy high-speed drivers ruining the road with their arsenal of tennis balls :mumble:

Yes. 100km/hr... not miles/hr.

[Phlamingoe]

that's impossible. ya're thinking newtonian, while ya should be thinkin relative.

This whole idea is impossible according to everything we currently know/think to be true. A laser can't actually blow up a ship, things don't even blow up in space.

Not true, unless you are saying there is not resistance due to wind.

When you are driving down the highway at 100, or a street at 60 ask your passenger to throw a tennis ball directly ball into the air... see what happens. Make sure there is no one behind you before you attempt this.

My gum getting thrown out the window of the car going down the highway appears to stay along side me. Now, someone get a car, a ball, and a high speed camera and test this out for us.