open and general discussion about anything on my mind :))

[[KMA]Avenger]

recently its been said in another of my topics that the speed of light is an impossibility, i'm of the firm belief that other life forms exist in the universe and that its very possible we have been visited, i'm not so much interested in debating weather this is indeed the case but am more interested in some thoughts that occurred to me when i was thinking about the vastness of space.

my logic is this...i believe 100% that life does not give us anything we cant handle (specific to the individual that is), and also believe that the universe and its secrets are there for 1 thing and 1 thing only...to be discovered...question, if traveling at the speed of light or faster is an impossibility then whats the point of having such a vast universe?

the size of the universe and time/speed needed to traverse it are IMHO, nothing more than a hurdle to be overcome...

your thoughts please.

[Kit-Fox]

Achieving the speed of light isnt impossible for an object, Einstiens theories do not make it impossible, just really stupidly improbable.

Not to mention that the energy required to reach such a speed for an object with any kind of measurable mass is something we cant do yet. Oh and i forgot to mention that our pyshical bodies probably wouldnt survive such speeds or the accelerations needed.

But it is probably likely that one day we will learn how to send an object (read: not human or something that is 'alive' ) out into the galaxy at such speeds.

[Cole]

Isn't hyperspace in Stargate equal to lightspeed? (or, in one case, faster than it when replicators modified hyperspace in 5x01 ep?).

[[KMA]Avenger]

Achieving the speed of light isnt impossible for an object, Einstiens theories do not make it impossible, just really stupidly improbable.

Not to mention that the energy required to reach such a speed for an object with any kind of measurable mass is something we cant do yet. Oh and i forgot to mention that our pyshical bodies probably wouldn't survive such speeds or the accelerations needed.

But it is probably likely that one day we will learn how to send an object (read: not human or something that is 'alive' ) out into the galaxy at such speeds.

ok, you'll have to be patient with me because i'm no scientist, however, i do have common sense so i wont dispute sound logic...

with our present state of technology i agree that these velocity's and technology's needed to first achieve and then survive FTL travel is not possible so i'm theorizing and talking about future possibility's and also discussing the point of such vastness with no obvious (maybe not obvious to us because of our level of knowledge) means of traversing it.

i think achieving the speed of light for the exploration/colonization of the universe is not very practical, its excellent for getting round our solar system but as i understand it, unless its a last ditched attempt to save mankind and the species of this planet, light speed is not practical for anything else because of the time differential of something/one traveling at that speed.
but what about wormholes, hyperspace and other forms of faster than light travel?

as for the inertial pressure, i assume some kind of counter force is possible, inertial dampers if you will?

i just cant see the point of having a universe so vast if no means of getting round it was possible regardless of how advanced our tech and science is/will be...

do you see what i'm getting at?

[pogopolis]

I've read that They're developing a new 'Crystal Memory' chip that is able to store and Retrieve data as fast as the speed of light. And it's able to store Quads of data really small. And that it's really just the retrieval rate of data that takes time...

However, I've also read that the eventual expansion rate of Our Universe will eventually overtake the speed of light and stars will start winking out in the sky, because the light will now take too long to get here.

But if Einsteins theory holds out, in that time, wouldn't light still travel the same speed relativly, meaning that micro distances such as planet based sight to sight radio transmissions would still work?

And how about that new Ion Propulsion...This could be the way.

I don't know if wormholes or Hyperspace actually exist...
But there's always Chaos Theory to say, It's possible.
I've spent some time studying what knowledge we have of Black Holes and not everything escapes the gravity swell. We detect Black Holes by the X-Rays that are given off in polar bursts. And there's always that pesky math thing, the singularity;...

And I love Heisenbergs Principle.

I'll win the lottery some day..........

[Kit-Fox]

As stated KMA, Eintstiens theories do not mean light speed is unachievable. What they do mean when translated into nice clear english is that the energy required to achieve light speed is so immense that it is for all intents and purposes impossible to produce.

Wormholes / hyperspace / Warp etc have absolutely no basis in realistic scientific fact. There in only some very tentative speculation about such things as we just dont know enough.

Hell even the first paragraph of this post assumes Einstien was correct, he might very well have got it catastrophically wrong, and as such all we have based on it is wrong too. We wont know that for many years yet methinks however.

Oh and the Hiesenberg principle is more commonly associated with teh idea of transporters (explaining why in star trek they have a Hiesenberg compensator module in em ) rather than FTL travel as you dont need to know the exact precise details of every atom to travel at FTL speeds (or so we think..)

[Thriller]

I think it's naive to believe the universe was created to placate our own curiosity. You can't accelerate beyond the speed of light. That's just how it works.

[[KMA]Avenger]

ok, my bad for not being more specific with my first post...


the point i'm trying to make stems more from a philosophical stand point of view rather than a scientific one.
what i'm trying to say is this...what is the point of having such a vast universe if there is no way anyone can explore it regardless of the technological knowledge gained?
for the universe to be this big it means there is a way to get around it, even if we don't have that knowledge.
i'm not so much interested in the viability of any single "engine" type or shortcut such as a wormhole as much as i am about why the universe would be so big if there was no way we can get around it as we do with say taking a 200 mile car journey, to sum it up, i believe its possible for someone to go from 1 end of the universe to the other in a matter of a few short hours or days at most, otherwise imho there's very little point in having a universe so vast.
if there is no way we can make such a journey then the universe may as well have ended at the borders of our galaxy...


i'm sorry but its sometimes very difficult for me to express in words exactly what i'm thinking. so, you see what i'm trying to say?

I think it's naive to believe the universe was created to placate our own curiosity. You can't accelerate beyond the speed of light. That's just how it works.

this isn't about ego, weather you believe the universe just happened or not, theres very little point in the universe or some "Creator" creating such vastness just to keep all sentient species which inhabit it separated due to its expanse, or for those same sentient's never being able to see more than a VERY small fraction of whats out there, that's not logical.

[Thriller]

I think it's naive to believe the universe was created to placate our own curiosity. You can't accelerate beyond the speed of light. That's just how it works.

this isn't about ego, weather you believe the universe just happened or not, theres very little point in the universe or some "Creator" creating such vastness just to keep all sentient species which inhabit it separated due to its expanse, or for those same sentient's never being able to see more than a VERY small fraction of whats out there, that's not logical.

What does that have to do with not being able to accelerate past the speed of light. Research other theories plzzzz.

[[KMA]Avenger]

ok, my bad for not being more specific with my first post...


the point i'm trying to make stems more from a philosophical stand point of view rather than a scientific one.
what i'm trying to say is this...what is the point of having such a vast universe if there is no way anyone can explore it regardless of the technological knowledge gained?
for the universe to be this big it means there is a way to get around it, even if we don't have that knowledge.
i'm not so much interested in the viability of any single "engine" type or shortcut such as a wormhole as much as i am about why the universe would be so big if there was no way we can get around it as we do with say taking a 200 mile car journey

as i've already said, i'm not interested in debating the viability of any engine or propulsion system or the existence (or lack of) of worm holes or other such things.

this isn't a debate about the viability of any type of science or what not...with me?

[Kit-Fox]

Sorry KMA, in attempting to answer your question I seem to have derailed it.

My apologies

[[KMA]Avenger]

no problem my friend, i may not have been as clear as i would have hoped.

no harm, no foul

[pogopolis]

ok, my bad for not being more specific with my first post...


the point i'm trying to make stems more from a philosophical stand point of view rather than a scientific one.
what i'm trying to say is this...what is the point of having such a vast universe if there is no way anyone can explore it regardless of the technological knowledge gained?
for the universe to be this big it means there is a way to get around it, even if we don't have that knowledge.
i'm not so much interested in the viability of any single "engine" type or shortcut such as a wormhole as much as i am about why the universe would be so big if there was no way we can get around it as we do with say taking a 200 mile car journey, to sum it up, i believe its possible for someone to go from 1 end of the universe to the other in a matter of a few short hours or days at most, otherwise imho there's very little point in having a universe so vast.
if there is no way we can make such a journey then the universe may as well have ended at the borders of our galaxy...


i'm sorry but its sometimes very difficult for me to express in words exactly what i'm thinking. so, you see what i'm trying to say?

I think it's naive to believe the universe was created to placate our own curiosity. You can't accelerate beyond the speed of light. That's just how it works.

this isn't about ego, weather you believe the universe just happened or not, theres very little point in the universe or some "Creator" creating such vastness just to keep all sentient species which inhabit it separated due to its expanse, or for those same sentient's never being able to see more than a VERY small fraction of whats out there, that's not logical.

I think that Our Universe is (t)here to Imagine.
Our imaginations ARE our universe. To explore.
If you can imagine it,...it can be.

[Deaths_Rider]

while i agree with you that something will be able to cross the universe one day you have made two big assumptions

first
that the universe has a point! this is it's own disscuson lets speak of it no more here

second
that we are the longest living sentient life or at least compareable with others

just here on earth we have species that live for a few hours and others for hundreds of years whos to say that somewhere out there there isnt a species that can traverse the universe at light speed and relative to it's life span it's a short trip

possible?

[[KMA]Avenger]

very possible, but i'm thinking more in terms of the a human lifetime.

its also quite possible that there is no point whatsoever to the universe and it is what it is but i HIGHLY doubt that...call it faith for my reasoning in that assumption