Capitalism - Appy vs. GhostyGoo

[[KMA]Avenger]

as i said...deaf ears.


if i invest all my money in some cattle that suddenly all drop dead, then that was my decision to make, i wanted more money so i made an investment, said investment goes bad...thats the luck of the draw...

however, if i buy a house for £100,000 today, it should still be worth £100,000 tomorrow or the day after tomorrow or the year after next.

as for the bread, if a loaf costs £1 today it is still worth £1 tomorrow, the fact that there are no ingredients (for whatever reason) to make the bread does not impact on its value...

your confusing value for profiteering....

tell me something Appy, is capitalism sustainable? look at the dollar, the dollar now is worth roughly 2 maybe 3 cents of what it was worth prior to the establishment of the Federal Reserve, is that not transference of wealth in the form of a stealth tax known as deflation/devaluation?

[CRASSUS]

as i said...deaf ears.

if i invest all my money in some cattle that suddenly all drop dead, then that was my decision to make, i wanted more money so i made an investment, said investment goes bad...thats the luck of the draw...

however, if i buy a house for £100,000 today, it should still be worth £100,000 tomorrow or the day after tomorrow or the year after next.

as for the bread, if a loaf costs £1 today it is still worth £1 tomorrow, the fact that there are no ingredients (for whatever reason) to make the bread does not impact on its value...

your confusing value for profiteering.

If you bought a house for 100,000 this is running off of buyer sentiment. You bought it for 100,000 because you liked the neighborhood and the schools nearby, and you felt that the house was well built. There was a limited amount of homes for sale in this nice neighborhood and so the price is high, because everyone thinks they are worth the price.

But then something happens, the school receives bad grades, a couple people foreclose in the neighborhood, etc, etc. And then people say "100,000? no way. 80,000 max." and so the prices fall.

Yes of course it effects the value, when you are selling off that you can make 100 loafs of bread a day, you will sell it for $1. But then you can only make 10 loafs of bread a day, you can't afford the same amount of wheat etc, so you have so sell them for $10.

[[KMA]Avenger]

if a house is worth £100,000 today it is still worth that much regardless if the house is located in a secluded wood 10's of miles from the next house or community, that's a simple fact, but we have been taught that supply and demand dictates the value. that's a fallacy that everyone in the world who doesn't understand the banking systems true purpose is welcomed to.

you've failed to grasp the fact that our money is devalued on purpose.

you didn't answer my 2 questions from above, maybe because i edited the post and you haven't seen?

[CRASSUS]

I didnt' see the edits.

Supply and Demand do cover price, you don't pay as much for a burger anymore because meat is in higher supply then demand, you can eat apples for cheap year long because supply of apples is higher then demand. Despite 50 years ago, buying an apple in the off-season would cost you far more because of import costs from South America or Australia, whatever.

A house that sells for 100,000 is not one that is built for 100,000. if you build a house for 100,000 that is beautiful and well kept it will be a relatively 'safe' investment, 100,000 to 80,000. But anything you buy is subject to change, it's just the fact of life. People thought having a certain style of furniture was big in the 50's, now that style is seen as ridiculous and old and those manufacturers changed with the times or went out of business.

tell me something Appy, is capitalism sustainable? look at the dollar, the dollar now is worth roughly 2 maybe 3 cents of what it was worth prior to the establishment of the Federal Reserve, is that not transference of wealth in the form of a stealth tax known as deflation/devaluation?

Capitalism is sustainable, of course. Theres no reason it would collapse....

Do you know our GDP before the Federal Reserve? around 73.1 billion dollars. There are people in the world with more assets then that now. In that time American currency was used just in America, it was also held by a gold standard, if there was a 300 million dollars in circulation, then 1 dollar was worth...say an ounce of gold for fun.

But now we are a world currency, with over 2 billion dollars in cash at this very moment trading hands. Keeping our currency on a gold standard kept our money high, but made it more expensive to spend, if we wanted people to spend lots of it and gain the amount of money that we did we needed it to be worth less, so we put more and more money into circulation and more and more people around the world spent it.

But for fun, lets say that our GDP before the Fed was 73.1 billion dollars, as you said 1 dollar in those days is worth around $100 in our terms. 73.1 billion times 100 is 7310 billion, or 7.310 trillion dollars. Our GDP was around 14 trillion last year.

[[KMA]Avenger]

so, in short, you support the current financial Federal Reserve system?

[CRASSUS]

so, in short, you support the current financial Federal Reserve system?

In a sense. I don't like that it's a federal bank and never audited or charged with the same level of federal regulations that other banks are. However if they are audited I am sure that nothing shocking would happen.

[[KMA]Avenger]

However if they are audited I am sure that nothing shocking would happen.

you 100% sure about that?

[CRASSUS]

However if they are audited I am sure that nothing shocking would happen.

you 100% sure about that?

of course not, I don't have any proof. But i'm as sure as I logically can be.

[[KMA]Avenger]

well, i spose if there is anything to be found or not would depend on how open, honest and independent the audit is.

[Taure]

Given that there hasn't been such an audit, I'm curious as to how Avenger seems to know that such an audit (if honest) would unveil shocking things, which is what his comments imply.

[[KMA]Avenger]

and why do you think that no such audit has ever been carried out, not just on the fed but also of the gold at Fort Knox?

even though many senators for many years have been demanding an audit on both, the fed has blocked all attempts of an audit...now why is that?

[Taure]

even though many senators for many years have been demanding an audit on both, the fed has blocked all attempts of an audit

[Citation needed]

[[KMA]Avenger]

insert this for your Citation:


1, the fed according to the constitution is an illegal institution, the 14th amendment was never ratified and the supreme court has ruled that the 14th amendment did not grant any new powers of taxation (even if it had been ratified). this is fact and not fiction.

2, there's been a joke going round for a few years that there's no gold in Fort Knox, this is NOT a joke, the gold in Fort Knox (the peoples gold which FDR stole from the people), has been taken by the FED as collateral against the debt. since the debt can never be repaid without destroying the money in circulation (money is generated by debt, go research the "fractional reserve banking" system which is what we have), the debt will never be repaid, so kiss your gold goodbye.

3, if an audit were to be undertaken, all these truths would come out for all to see, the fact that most don't even know that the Bank Of England and The Federal Reserve are private for profit corporations independent of our nations and totally uncountable to them is a testament to the ignorance of the masses (me included).

4, the Fed are more powerful than the US Govt...FACT!

[Juliette]

That is no citation, G.. that is just you saying why you think what you think without referring to any documented fact.

Loosely, a citation is a reference to a published or unpublished source (not always the original source). More precisely, a citation is an abbreviated alphanumeric expression (e.g. [Newell84]) embedded in the body of a intellectual work that denotes an entry in the bibliographic references section of the work for the purpose of acknowledging the relevance of the works of others to the topic of discussion at the spot where the citation appears. Generally the combination of both the in-body citation and the bibliographic entry constitutes what is commonly thought of as a citation (whereas bibliographic entries by themselves are not).

A prime purpose of a citation is intellectual honesty; to attribute to other authors the ideas they have previously expressed, rather than give the appearance to the work's readers that the work's authors are the original wellsprings of those ideas.

Wikipedia.

[[KMA]Avenger]

sweety, what i have cited is FACT and easily verifiable if 1 is willing to go look, its all in the congressional record.

i may not have used a citational formula but its all true....otherwise i wouldnt have written it.