Reform proposals

[GhostyGoo]

our laws

Wrong.

This is your final solution Sir, i am trying to open your eyes to your laws.

-Goo™

[Legendary Apophis]

our laws

Wrong.

This is your final solution Sir, i am trying to open your eyes to your laws.

-Goo™

Whatever.

I could talk about a great bunch of people who would need to open their eyes...BUT WAIT...that wouldn't be about same problem, so that means it wouldn't be right, I suppose?

[GhostyGoo]

Admittedly you and I do keep trying to keep this topic on track Apophis, however, this does not raise you above the natural order of debate.

I would very much like to align myself with everyone but sadly, as any logically aligned earthling would agree, i have to align myself (based on my opinon of such) towards submitted evidence. Is this not how the Law operates? It's very hard to understand the Law without having a fundamental knowledge of philosophy because "natural law" or "common law" IS philosophy.

Why is this about reform?

The reform that we are about to undertake, much like the reformation of Iraq, is illegal.

It's happened because CAPITAL and not ETHICS were the driving force behind the reform.

-Goo™

[Legendary Apophis]

Admittedly you and I do keep trying to keep this topic on track Apophis, however, this does not raise you above the natural order of debate.

I would very much like to align myself with everyone but sadly, as any logically aligned earthling would agree, i have to align myself (based on my opinon of such) towards submitted evidence. Is this not how the Law operates? It's very hard to understand the Law without having a fundamental knowledge of philosophy because "natural law" or "common law" IS philosophy.

Why is this about reform?

The reform that we are about to undertake, much like the reformation of Iraq, is illegal.

It's happened because CAPITAL and not ETHICS were the driving force behind the reform.

-Goo™

Illegal perhaps, but needed
I also doubt your socialist saviour would solve current problems I mentionned earlier with few sources (ohhh wait, I thought I never posted sources, how could it be??? Perhaps I am posting them, afterall!). Because there, you do face a different culture, with different motives, manipulated by fundamentalism.
You want socialism? They are going to abuse it. Help poor classes in EU? It's already the case, and guess what, it incitates immigration. Now, limiting that would be unethical right?

I'll go find more sources whenever I have time to back my claims.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 398782.ece

[Juliette]

This thread has come to remind me of the following.

Lois Griffin: "I found an ad for a used car from the paper."
Peter Griffin: "Oh, no. A guy at work got a car from the paper, two years later, Bam! Herpes."

*from: Family Guy (episode "There's Something About Paulie")

As seems to be usual around these parts, I will leave it at that, and expect you all to fully understand my point.
Hey, I'm giving you guys more information as you need, because actually, you know all this already, your eyes have been covered with the mud of the earth. (Stupid oil! omg omg I hate it it's so evil get ur black liquidic stuff back into the ground.) I even cited the relevant part.. Now, if you don't come to the same conclusion I have come to after spending a lot of time researching this, you must re-read it. Ultimately, you must either come to the same conclusion or accept that you are immeasurably stupid.


Edit: I found out which episode this came from, so added that. By all means though, find out for yourselves.

[Ridd1ck]

Seriously, what this lot needs is a firm hand. Obviously when you allow them to homeschool and procreate like your average rabbits, you promote the mushrooming of ridiculous fantasies. No. The solution, as always, is simple but drastic. Given the mindset of the average person, it won't ever become a reality, but here goes, once more unto the breach!

. Education (tuition fees and book expenses) is free for all citizens (immigrant and full alike), and is obligatory for everyone under 18. People who show exceptional ability are promoted to higher education (more fine-tuned to their capacities and aiming to unlock their full potential). People who are unable to pass a basic survivability (physical and mental health) test by the age of 16 will be relocated until they are able to pass their test.
. Healthcare is free for full citizens, market pricing applies for immigrant citizens, and very basic healthcare will be awarded to non-citizens unless there are exceptional circumstances regarding their citizenship. Long-term (1+ year) hospitalization is not an option for any citizen under full citizen level. Healthcare is paid for by corporations, who in turn receive free (proportional) airtime for commercials on any state-subsidized networks (time is increased/decreased as budgetary needs vary).
. All human reproduction before personal debts are cleared is prohibited. Illegal offspring of proper physique will be awarded to infertile, eligible persons. Immigrant-citizens without personal debts are allowed to reproduce within the limits set by the state authorities, depending on work availability and education capacity.
. Immigration ends tonight. Batch immigration based on work availability will be a considerable option to relieve pressure on the citizenry. However, police will not actively hunt for illegal immigrants. Any (illegal) immigrant who keeps a job (and as such, out of the police's sights) for 1 year and 1 day will be awarded immigrant-citizenship. After another 7 years of crimeless employment, full citizenship can be awarded.
. Citizenship will be taken from people who are officially bankrupt, and/or sentenced in cases regarding felonies. One month after clearing of their debts, citizenship will be restored to their previous level.
. All citizens are allowed the right to vote. Immigrant citizens are not allowed in any political office. Any office above mayor requires unchallenged evidence of fourth generation citizenship (person, parents, grandparents and greatgrandparents have to have been full citizens without interruptions - i.e. personal debts/clean justice sheet).
. Anyone serving in the Police force will be awarded £ 25k upon finishing a 25 year term of service without any substantiated complaints lodged against them. Similar arrangements will be made for Fire department, Emergency Coordination personnel.
. Convicts are allowed no personal possessions other than money, and their personal possessions will be converted to money upon starting serving a 15+ year sentence. State penitentiary facilities provide a survivable situation for any and all convicts, regardless of their crimes. Capital punishment is allowed as per state authority's decision, amnesty can be granted by state and federal authorities. In situations where a threat against the nation is imminent, any and all rights of convicts can and will be suspended at the federal government's discretion. 90% majority vote is required (which in the case of a threat to the nation will contain a 25% vote of the Head of State - tiebreaker).
. Legislation is under continuous evaluation by a special federal commission, working together with Federal and State Supreme Courts. In situations where international cooperation is agreeable, this commission will also cooperate with the International Court.
. Popular votes (referendum) can be called at the discretion of state and federal authorities. This vote will account for 51% in regards to any decision the populace is called to vote upon. Voting facilities will be made available upon acquisition of (any kind of) citizenship.



I think I was.. gentle.. don't let the first few proposals shock you into not reading on. Also, don't dismiss the proposals because it is I who propose them. No one here is that petty. (Except perhaps me.. *hides*)

Not just pretty, but smart as well. Rare combination. But one point I disagree with is the illegals. They should ALL be rounded up and shipped back where they came from. Then we should actively patrol the border with a minimum of 50,000 troops that have the green light to shoot anything that crosses the border illegally.

[Legendary Apophis]

That's out of proportions to deal with immigration this way. We aren't dictatorships like North Korea.

But one point I disagree with is the illegals. They should ALL be rounded up and shipped back where they came from. Then we should actively patrol the border with a minimum of 50,000 troops that have the green light to shoot anything that crosses the border illegally.

[GhostyGoo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpq7TtMEBFA&

i don't see what relevance this has on anything.

Apparently in 2020 Britain will have a muslim majority in parliament. Good luck. I'll still believe women have as much right to the land as men.

-Goo™

[GhostyGoo]

That's out of proportions to deal with immigration this way. We aren't dictatorships like North Korea.

Yet you, admittedly, by YOUR OWN DECREE...would sanction nationwide enforced birth control.

Not a dictatorship. Of course.

-Goo™

[Legendary Apophis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpq7TtMEBFA&

i don't see what relevance this has on anything.

Apparently in 2020 Britain will have a muslim majority in parliament. Good luck. I'll still believe women have as much right to the land as men.

-Goo™

Radicalisation of society, unwanted one.
A result of uncontrolled immigration, and massive presence of unintegrated immigrants, who prefer to stick to their own culture than adopt the one of their new home. Trying to make sure their traditions remain, even if they are in contradiction with country's ones.

Not so surprising considering UK police moves giving up secular positions:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... rkhas.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... badge.html

Was it really necessary of them? No. But that goes well with estimations in parliament (islam influence growing in all levels of society). Now, make up your mind...it doesn't even need to dig far to find all of that. Not even top secret stuff, yet many people ignore that.
Extreme tolerance, that never does well when people infront don't have really good intentions..

-----------------------
http://www.leparisien.fr/societe/le-mai ... 604601.php
http://www.maire-info.com/article.asp?p ... ARAM2=PLUS
Problems in swimming pool in France about muslim bathing suit (whatever it's called).
That is more related to issues regarding traditions than the video. They don't want to adapt, they want it to adapt to them.. And some socialist (oh! ) politicians follow.. (2nd link)


-----------------------
More related to the video (as it also concerns politics, but Belgium this time),
[spoiler][/spoiler]
Now, you will tell me why not muslim people in parliaments? When you consider the following:
[spoiler][/spoiler]
Notice how it was *conveniently* edited to make sure hijab/veil wouldn't be noticed by voters?

When you have muslims in your lists, you don't hide them!

Now again the nice veiled woman attracting controversy around her
http://www.lalibre.be/actu/belgique/art ... istes.html

-----------------------
Now, for the "wow" part...
http://www.liberation.fr/monde/01015815 ... a-bon-porc
That one fits well with the Rotterdam article.

Oh btw you said you didn't care if my sources weren't in english lol. So don't blame me now please!

Now, for [few] people who understand french and read those articles, before saying I mean this or that...see by yourself, said facts being used by far right parties to get themselves more votes. If nothing is being done, well, they will earn more votes, and that, at least I, don't want to happen. But I don't want EITHER to have EU changing the way the dude in the video said.

[Ridd1ck]

That's out of proportions to deal with immigration this way. We aren't dictatorships like North Korea.

But one point I disagree with is the illegals. They should ALL be rounded up and shipped back where they came from. Then we should actively patrol the border with a minimum of 50,000 troops that have the green light to shoot anything that crosses the border illegally.

Coming from someone in the EU I understand your passiveness. What is coming across the Southern border of the United States is equalivent to an all out invasion. It should be treated as such. And now with the out break of swine (h1/n1) now it's a BIOLOGICAL invasion as the suspected source of h1/n1 is Mexico.