reascention

[daivahataka]

(a) unlike registering ascending is an instant process so you're definitely able to log in.
well, its supposed to be instant but i still haven't gotten the e-mail cuz of the bug

Note that I said on your reset main account, you don't get an e-mail for this, you just log in as you did pre-ascending. If you didn't get PPT for the start-up on the ascended server then that's a whole different story as you need that to settle in to the new environment and this could become an issue later, when all aspects of the ascended server are up and running.

(b) the state the reset account will be in will make it worthless to any potential attacker, the only exceptions would be where people have stashed UU/naq before ascending because they're too lazy to put in the effort of ascending again from scratch, in which case: Ha!HA!
same as Mack said. u can't change the rules for the later ppl in favor of letting the previous ppl off. either descend the previous ppl or let the transfers happen

This only happened before i got all my stuff transfered over. u try starting sgw as a new account w/out a ppt

Well as I've said I did, and will in all future instances, reset with a new account, as to whether I get PPT I don't care as, assuming you don't recieve transfers from other players, you start out with such pityful resources you're not worth attacking with so many viable inactive accounts to attack out there, all earning decent amounts of naq per turn.

Let me put things this way, would you rather to be stuck playing catch up to 100 people or 500?

[buster]

Has anybody got a response from admin yet?

[(Thewisesirivanthes)]

This happened from the beginning, so if they wanted to stop it, the admins would have. Why should I have to lose everything in main, when those who have ascended 6 times already did'nt?

When Europeans first began to settle in America it was a free for all, grab whatever land you can keep situation, does this mean they should've kept that system indefinitely?

Newsflash they did. The only reason it stopped was because they ran out of land after everyone claimed it all. This wasn't just for North America either this is how its been for the entire world throughout history. The cycles of free land and the subsquent grabbing of it only ends when there is no more land to grab. Its not around to day becuase there is no more unclaimed land on the surface of the earth period. There is a lot underwater but that is unavailable becasue of technological reasons. Even all the parts of Antartica have been claimed by over 20 different countries so there isn't any free land there either so don't get started on that one. We will see the free land system come back when we start exploring and colinizing other worlds or even our oceans, but once they run out of land agian then it will stop for another period of time until even more unclaimed land is discovered. Besides not starting over from scratch isn't being lazy or playing on easy, you are simply challenging yourself by doing so. Don't force your ideas on beliefs onto others. If people wanted to start over from scratch after ascending like you they would, but don't judge the rest of us simply because we feel like keeping our stuff. We worked hard to get it and we are entitled to keep it plus some of us have commitments to others that limit our choices without being incredibly selfish and ruining your alliances power simply becuase you want a challenge IS selfish. Now you don't have to worry about that seeing how you are on your own but not all of us are on our own and I know I wouldn't give up the friendships I've made simply to have a challenge that I don't even want.

[Sleipnir]

According to my intel reascension should be fixed now.

[buster]

what about the players who ascended and didnt get there ascended power points, name changed, i.e Incarnate of the indu and the free ppt. Has that been sorted yet or is that still being sorted?

[daivahataka]

Besides not starting over from scratch isn't being lazy or playing on easy, you are simply challenging yourself by doing so. Don't force your ideas on beliefs onto others.

Voicing my views is not forcing my beliefs, that would be altering the game code to prevent the option.

If people wanted to start over from scratch after ascending like you they would, but don't judge the rest of us simply because we feel like keeping our stuff.

So should the person who gets a good grade in school via bribing examiners be deemed to be just as well educated as the one who did so via actual studying? Pretty sure the latter would think little of the former.

We worked hard to get it and we are entitled to keep it plus some of us have commitments to others that limit our choices without being incredibly selfish and ruining your alliances power simply becuase you want a challenge IS selfish.

An alliance that falls with the loss of one person is not an alliance, just parasites unable to stand alone. I'm pretty sure the other members of your alliance can do without your strength for the 2-3 months it takes to rebuild or do you think so little of your allies?

Now you don't have to worry about that seeing how you are on your own but not all of us are on our own and I know I wouldn't give up the friendships I've made simply to have a challenge that I don't even want.

I have a fair few friends throughout the sites who I've become such with out of mutual respect, if your friends would turn their backs on you because you suddenly weren't strong are they really your friends? "Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer."
Ascending hasn't hurt my friendships, don't see why it should hurt yours.

what about the players who ascended and didnt get there ascended power points, name changed, i.e Incarnate of the indu and the free ppt. Has that been sorted yet or is that still being sorted?

Hopefully he has fixed this, the extra points are far too vital in the first few days of your ascended account.

[Shizune-sama]

i'm still not fixed yet >.<

[buster]

same here, hopefully will be fixed soon.

[MackTheKnife]

Well, my post was'nt me, it was someone else.

Half Hearted? there are MINIMUM requirements for a reason, and banning "sending stuff away" is unworkable and would kill ascension, because no-one would do it.

I'd still do it. Surely your ego can stand being outside the top rankings in a video game for longer than you need to if it means going the whole hog and not taking short cuts? Would it not be something of greater merit to have put in the full effort to do it as originally intended?

You are simply adding extra difficultly for no reason, I don't know if you've read about this stuff, but check out "playing to win" by sirlin
http://www.sirlin.net/Features/feature_ ... nPart1.htm
Basically, if you are not using every legal advantage to win, you are a scrub, with made up rules that you want everyone else to apply to, no-one cares about your little "i'm so 1337, I start clean", because everyone else is busy re-ascending. When players like vanrain, etl, neb (I think) etc etc are already 5 or 6 times ascended, using this very strategy, I'd be stupid to not do it myself, and it's legal anyway, so I have no qualms at all with doing it.

You bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevent him from ever truly competing.

This happened from the beginning, so if they wanted to stop it, the admins would have. Why should I have to lose everything in main, when those who have ascended 6 times already did'nt?

When Europeans first began to settle in America it was a free for all, grab whatever land you can keep situation, does this mean they should've kept that system indefinitely?

That "free land" grab was a simple aspect of the times in which they lived, no-one had previously landed in America, and no-one had colonised it. After this land grab became unsastanible, it stopped of it's own accord. This hardly has anything to do with the game anyway. It's a false analogy.

The system works. Everyone agrees to it, only you seem to not like it, why should I have to not use the system as it stands, the admins have kept it since day 1. There is no need to change it, and I would be stupid if I did not use it to my full advantage, no-one is going to give me a gold star for starting from scratch are they? Do you get any real reward for it? No, you just get further and further behind everyone else, and they will not care.

Are you saying you will be reascending every time with a totally wiped account? Good luck ascending another couple of times in the next 5 months. Unless you have good help, which is the same as doing this anyway.

Yep, done it once so far and only 2-3weeks before I do it again.[/quote]

Well, that's your perogative.

We need a PPT for the very purpose of getting back our naq and UU we have sent away (legally I might add) before we ascend. If I choose to have more naq or UU, to help me rebuild, that's my choice alone, not yours. If you chose to start over again, then that's your choice, but do not belittle my choice because you think it's "half hearted". I don't think i'm "lazy", I don't want all of the work I've put into for 6 months being flushed down the drain unneccsarrily.

Gee if that last sentence isn't a round-about way of saying "I'm too lazy to restart from scratch" I don't know what is.

So? You say it's "lazy", I say it's "Smart". I have decided that certain things are worth losing an amount of APP, and will sell or send them away to improve my ability to rebuild, it's not lazy, it's playing the game properly.

Do you have officers? A commander? An alliance? If you do, then you are just doing the same thing as what we do with naq and UU, it just might take slightly longer. Only if you start completely wiped from scratch, and get no help can you claim to be any different.

1 officer who adds less than 110 UP per day in exchange for >3mil per turn, more of a hindrance than a help (he was on vacation mode for most of the time since the reset) but he was my officer before I ascended so I'm cool with it. No commander (never had one) & no alliance (again never had one) so sorry to burst your bubble but I can claim to be completely different!
Anyway, I'll leave you to keep playing games on easy mode while I pick the harder difficulty settings.

Okay, i'll keep playing StarGateWars, you can keep playing your made up version with special rules that only apply to you.

[Jack_White]

I have just realised that even though my ascention did/nt work properly i still got my extra 5% on everything so the only problem i have is the missing 9,386 ascention power points, im a Messiah of the INDU when i should be a Incarnate and didnt get the full free ppt.

-þrø Têçh

Well, I didn't go out as bad as some of you guys, but I want my title!
I'm supposed to be a goddamn Messiah, not some lowly Prophet
This is frustrating... I was looking forward to gloating about my new title to my friend, but I have to wait it seems..

[daivahataka]

You are simply adding extra difficultly for no reason, I don't know if you've read about this stuff, but check out "playing to win" by sirlin
http://www.sirlin.net/Features/feature_ ... nPart1.htm
Basically, if you are not using every legal advantage to win, you are a scrub, with made up rules that you want everyone else to apply to, no-one cares about your little "i'm so 1337, I start clean", because everyone else is busy re-ascending. When players like vanrain, etl, neb (I think) etc etc are already 5 or 6 times ascended, using this very strategy, I'd be stupid to not do it myself, and it's legal anyway, so I have no qualms at all with doing it.

You bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevent him from ever truly competing.

I add it for the reason of prefering to follow the original intent of the ascending proceedure, why do you think Forum had to expand the number of players getting G&R points? The original idea was to flush out the top rankings, keep the game ranks from becoming stagnant, but due to this loophole it only did so for the 2-3 weeks it took these players to rebuild after the first ascention.

That "free land" grab was a simple aspect of the times in which they lived, no-one had previously landed in America, and no-one had colonised it. After this land grab became unsastanible, it stopped of it's own accord. This hardly has anything to do with the game anyway. It's a false analogy.

American Indians previously lived in America and they were just brushed aside.
You go in kill the occupant there's now free land to grab it this never became unsustainable, it was abandoned because "whatever it takes to get ahead" doesn't work in society, it benefits the individual but hurts the whole and is the whole reason laws and punishments for breaking those laws were developed in the first place.

The system works. Everyone agrees to it, only you seem to not like it, why should I have to not use the system as it stands, the admins have kept it since day 1. There is no need to change it, and I would be stupid if I did not use it to my full advantage, no-one is going to give me a gold star for starting from scratch are they? Do you get any real reward for it? No, you just get further and further behind everyone else, and they will not care.

Actually there are a few of us who honour the original intent of Ascending and give up all our units and naq rather than stashing it. Forum has kept it as it is too difficult to prevent without a player to player transfer block which would just have too many people complaining.
Since the use of this loophole is so widespread I'm not really falling behind, the players who were ahead of me before ascention started will always be ahead of everyone else, due to having been amassing UU, miners, troops and weapons longer than the rest of us, those who were behind me still seem to be such.

Well, that's your perogative.

As stashing stuff is your's, doesn't mean I'm going to think you're great and give you a pat on the back for it, now does it?

So? You say it's "lazy", I say it's "Smart". I have decided that certain things are worth losing an amount of APP, and will sell or send them away to improve my ability to rebuild, it's not lazy, it's playing the game properly.
By your logic paying someone else to play a character through the early levels in an MMORPG isn't being lazy, just "Smart" and "playing the game properly".

Okay, i'll keep playing StarGateWars, you can keep playing your made up version with special rules that only apply to you.

As I said there are a few of us who honour the original intent of ascending. Think on this, if I manage to repeatedly ascend this way and outrank players who used the loophole of stashing troops in either server should they not be plain embarassed that they still can't keep a lead on me even with this big advantage?
How is using this loophole any different to the PPT abuse that used to be rampant in the game until Forum decided that measures had to be introduced for the good of the game?

[MackTheKnife]

I add it for the reason of prefering to follow the original intent of the ascending proceedure, why do you think Forum had to expand the number of players getting G&R points? The original idea was to flush out the top rankings, keep the game ranks from becoming stagnant, but due to this loophole it only did so for the 2-3 weeks it took these players to rebuild after the first ascention.

It has been like this since ascension started. There are no rules in place that mean that what we are doing is not legal. How am I supposed to detect the "intent" of the rules when I do not know forum personally, and I can only go by what the current rules are. These current rules tell me that I can do whatever I want before I ascend, send stuff away, buy more stuff, ascend and wipe clean etc etc.

The easiest way that forum could have done this, would have been to introduce a minimum time on reascensions, it was not, and was not introduced in the time quickly after ascension started, and has not been added since. I am not going to cripple my account based on some self made up rules that say I have to follow what I think could possibly be the intent that forum had for ascension, and not follow what the actual rules themself show..

I deleted your american indian tirade, because 1) I could care less, and 2) It has zero relevency on playing SGW.

Actually there are a few of us who honour the original intent of Ascending and give up all our units and naq rather than stashing it. Forum has kept it as it is too difficult to prevent without a player to player transfer block which would just have too many people complaining.

Good for you, continue to play your made up version of SGW, with rules about the possible intent that maybe forum was thinking about 4 months ago or whatever when he started ascension.

Since the use of this loophole is so widespread I'm not really falling behind, the players who were ahead of me before ascention started will always be ahead of everyone else, due to having been amassing UU, miners, troops and weapons longer than the rest of us, those who were behind me still seem to be such.

This is not a loophole, it is part of the game.

By your logic paying someone else to play a character through the early levels in an MMORPG isn't being lazy, just "Smart" and "playing the game properly".

And this is similar to SGW how? I have neither paid someone to play on my account, and have'nt paid for my account. Again, another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic. It might work If I had paid someone to play my account, but I have'nt. It might work if I've paid money to someone to get billions and billions of naq. But I have'nt, it's all my work, and no-one has been paid.

As I said there are a few of us who honour the original intent of ascending. Think on this, if I manage to repeatedly ascend this way and outrank players who used the loophole of stashing troops in either server should they not be plain embarassed that they still can't keep a lead on me even with this big advantage?
How is using this loophole any different to the PPT abuse that used to be rampant in the game until Forum decided that measures had to be introduced for the good of the game?

Until the rules were changed, PPT "abuse" was part of the game.

Again, another failed analogy, because this is'nt a loophole, it's part of the way ascension works. If you have a better idea, please post it in the Game Suggestions area.

I did'nt insult anyone who used PPT like that, because they were playing the game in the way they thought would help them the most.

And most people could care less if they are lower than you and you were so great you started without any help. They'll just think "Lol, what a noob, imagine if he actually played it smart and where would he be now".

One last thing, don't blame the players for poor game design. If people are allowed to ascend 2 times in a month, do not blame the players when they do ascend 2 times in a month, blame the game for allowing it to happen. Oh, and don't bring up cheating, because that's entierly differnt.

[daivahataka]

It has been like this since ascension started. There are no rules in place that mean that what we are doing is not legal. How am I supposed to detect the "intent" of the rules when I do not know forum personally, and I can only go by what the current rules are. These current rules tell me that I can do whatever I want before I ascend, send stuff away, buy more stuff, ascend and wipe clean etc etc.

I'm not saying that it's not allowed, Forum has never said it wasn't, I'm just saying that it goes against the spirit of ascending.

The easiest way that forum could have done this, would have been to introduce a minimum time on reascensions, it was not, and was not introduced in the time quickly after ascension started, and has not been added since.

Look at how long it took for restrictions upon PPT to be introduced, Forum has many games to run and can't spend all his time on just one of them.

I am not going to cripple my account based on some self made up rules that say I have to follow what I think could possibly be the intent that forum had for ascension, and not follow what the actual rules themself show..

If that would cripple your account then you really need to learn how to play. I take it you don't play QW and probably won't play CW if you can't handle the job of building up from a new account?

This is not a loophole, it is part of the game.

Yes a loophole within the game, think you need to look up what a loophole is...

By your logic paying someone else to play a character through the early levels in an MMORPG isn't being lazy, just "Smart" and "playing the game properly".

And this is similar to SGW how? I have neither paid someone to play on my account, and have'nt paid for my account. Again, another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic. It might work If I had paid someone to play my account, but I have'nt. It might work if I've paid money to someone to get billions and billions of naq. But I have'nt, it's all my work, and no-one has been paid.

Read back over your own arguement/develop a memory longer than 5 seconds.

So? You say it's "lazy", I say it's "Smart". I have decided that certain things are worth losing an amount of APP, and will sell or send them away to improve my ability to rebuild, it's not lazy, it's playing the game properly.

You say that using a method to avoid starting from scratch is not lazy, but smart. Paying someone else to do all the leveling of a character for you in a MMORPG is therefore not lazy but smart in your eyes. If money is the issue then perhaps if they did it for free/some non-monetary exchange it would be fine with you.
Sorry to break it to you but there is a world outside SGW, and just because my arguements reference it doesn't make them "another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic".

Until the rules were changed, PPT "abuse" was part of the game.

And yet it was perfectly acceptable for people to complain about PPT abuse then, but not for me (and others if you check around the forum) to complain about this. Look up the word hypocrite.

Again, another failed analogy, because this is'nt a loophole, it's part of the way ascension works. If you have a better idea, please post it in the Game Suggestions area.

Again you should really look up the word loophole:
• noun 1 an ambiguity or inadequacy in the law or a set of rules.

I did'nt insult anyone who used PPT like that, because they were playing the game in the way they thought would help them the most.

And most people could care less if they are lower than you and you were so great you started without any help. They'll just think "Lol, what a noob, imagine if he actually played it smart and where would he be now".

The worst thing I've called you was lazy and yet you escalate to "noob". Tax evasion is smart (as long as you don't get caught) and a lazy way to get richer, am I a "noob" for not trying that?

One last thing, don't blame the players for poor game design. If people are allowed to ascend 2 times in a month, do not blame the players when they do ascend 2 times in a month, blame the game for allowing it to happen.

Don't blame the shooters at Columbine, blame the guns for allowing them to kill people? (if you dismiss this as "another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic" I'll start to worry over your IQ as it's just restating your arguement in a more black and white context)
Players are expected to have some scruples. Forum's only now getting to really crack-down on multi-ing, there were changes he had to make to the code ages back to prevent the use of macros, he can't sort everything as soon as an issue occurs, he has to figure out a solution and how to implement it. The only thing I've been able to think of would be to prevent all reciepts of player to player transfers on the main SGW A/Cs of those who have ascended, and I have suggested such while also pointing out the flaw; too many people would complain though at the loss of this part of SS as they rely too much upon it.

[MackTheKnife]

I'm not saying that it's not allowed, Forum has never said it wasn't, I'm just saying that it goes against the spirit of ascending.

Who are you to decide what the "spirit" of ascending is or was. I'm playing the game, not some made up version with rules\guildelines\spirti that are'nt really rules.

Look at how long it took for restrictions upon PPT to be introduced, Forum has many games to run and can't spend all his time on just one of them.

So? PPT as it was then was part of the game. People played the game as it allowed them to, if they thought they would benefit from it. At first, it cost RL money, if people want to spend RL money on it then whatever, after, you could buy it in the market, but not everyone was able to use PPT "abuse" and it may not have helped them as much as some other tactic.

If that would cripple your account then you really need to learn how to play. I take it you don't play QW and probably won't play CW if you can't handle the job of building up from a new account?

Well, if you must know, I don't really play QW that much, I don't have the time for it. It does'nt appeal to me much beyond helping my main account, and helping some friends with an officer with a decent up. Chaos? I am playing that right now.

And anyways, QW and CW are not main. I have already built up my account in Main twice already, and since there are no rules preventing me from doing so, I choose to send much of my UU, and as much naq as I feel I need to, and get them back once I ascend. I've already built up once from "scratch" I don't feel the need to do that again whilst the rules allow me.

Yes a loophole within the game, think you need to look up what a loophole is...

There is no "loophole", this is not illegal, and there is no ambiguity in the way the rules define ascension, and transfers before it. It does not say "you cannot transfer", it does not stop me from transferring once I get 1000 GR points, it does not reject transfers back to me after I ascend, and there is nothing to suggest from previous people's ascensions that what I choose to do is a loophole in any way.

If you choose to take a mistaken view based on some false "spirit" or made up rules, then do it, but don't belittle me because of it.

You say that using a method to avoid starting from scratch is not lazy, but smart. Paying someone else to do all the leveling of a character for you in a MMORPG is therefore not lazy but smart in your eyes. If money is the issue then perhaps if they did it for free/some non-monetary exchange it would be fine with you.
Sorry to break it to you but there is a world outside SGW, and just because my arguements reference it doesn't make them "another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic".

It also has no relevency because:
1) I have not paid anyone to play on my account.
2) Did not pay for this account already ascended or built up.
3) I have not paid for any naq or UU beyond the in-game market.

That is why it's irrelevant. Not because I think this or that is lazy, but because that's not what happens. If someone pays for their account, then whoopdedo, they have paid for their account, that's not what I've done, and not what is being discussed.

And yet it was perfectly acceptable for people to complain about PPT abuse then, but not for me (and others if you check around the forum) to complain about this. Look up the word hypocrite.

A person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

I have not said my stance on PPT beyond "until it was changed it was part of the game", I don't know how you fathom that i'm a hypocrite from this, but I guess when you are struggling for an argument, you can just invent things. Again, maybe think of something intelligent rather than just pulling a word and saying "look it up".

The worst thing I've called you was lazy and yet you escalate to "noob". Tax evasion is smart (as long as you don't get caught) and a lazy way to get richer, am I a "noob" for not trying that?

Boo hoo, have a cry, you call me lazy for not wanting to start from scrath (as the game allows me to do within the rules), and I call you a noob because you are one. A noob\scrub will always be a noob\scrub until they can shed their fake rules that only they play with.

Don't blame the shooters at Columbine, blame the guns for allowing them to kill people?

Yes, because we are clearly discussing American Gun Laws, and how they apply in the modern world. I'm sorry, but this IS another pointless analogy, because you have completly wrong.

Anyways, I'll tear apart this one for free.

I say "Don't blame the game if players are able to ascend twice in a month, and then they go ahead and do that".

Which you have changed into:

Don't blame the killers (players), if the guns (game\transfers) enable them to commit murder (fast reascension).

Clearly, this is a false statement. Their is more than one reason why they committed those murders, including their mental state, the society in which they were raised (and how they were raised), and yes, access to guns.

Now, add the fact that murder is illegal (within reason obviously, but this was murder), and transferring this before ascension is not.

So yeah, it's another flawed analogy. I am starting to question your IQ, because you continue to come up with this false and irrelvant crap to support your flawed argument.

Players are expected to have some scruples. Forum's only now getting to really crack-down on multi-ing, there were changes he had to make to the code ages back to prevent the use of macros, he can't sort everything as soon as an issue occurs, he has to figure out a solution and how to implement it.

I don't really know what you are trying to say here, so I'll say again clearer:

If you allow something via the game rules\mechanics, expect it to be used to the players advantage. If you want something to not be legal despite it being possible in the game mechanics, then make it illegal in the rules.

Fast ascension\transfers are neither illegal in the rules, or illegal in the game mechanics. Macros, multi-ing etc is illegal, and backed up with game mechanic changes to make it harder.

Until Forum decides to make transfering and fast reascension illegal (easy way is to make you have to use everything you have to ascend), then expect players to do it, not because they have no scruples, but because they are not playing the game, not a made up version with special rules that only apply to them.

The only thing I've been able to think of would be to prevent all reciepts of player to player transfers on the main SGW A/Cs of those who have ascended, and I have suggested such while also pointing out the flaw; too many people would complain though at the loss of this part of SS as they rely too much upon it.

Okay, keep trying then, until you provide a viable alternative, nothing is going to change, so why insult players who choose to play within the proper rules of the game. It's not illegal, so do not treat it as such.

Honestly, i'm over this, so I'm finished posting here regarding this matter, I just don't have the time to continually destroy someone's weak arguments and false analogies when the issue is already defined as legal and not a "loophole".

[daivahataka]

I'm not saying that it's not allowed, Forum has never said it wasn't, I'm just saying that it goes against the spirit of ascending.

Who are you to decide what the "spirit" of ascending is or was. I'm playing the game, not some made up version with rules\guildelines\spirti that are'nt really rules.

Every single person on this forum knows that ascention was created due to people complaining about the top ranks being stagnant, the only way to fix this was to give the top people a reason to give up their rank, by not ascending with everything you've got you're only very briefly giving up your rank.

Look at how long it took for restrictions upon PPT to be introduced, Forum has many games to run and can't spend all his time on just one of them.

So? PPT as it was then was part of the game. People played the game as it allowed them to, if they thought they would benefit from it. At first, it cost RL money, if people want to spend RL money on it then whatever, after, you could buy it in the market, but not everyone was able to use PPT "abuse" and it may not have helped them as much as some other tactic.

Your point??? You've not made any rebuttal against what I've said.

Yes a loophole within the game, think you need to look up what a loophole is...

There is no "loophole", this is not illegal,[/quote]
Once again a loophole is not an illegal thing but rather a gap in the laws rules, that's 3 times I've had to point this out to you.

and there is no ambiguity in the way the rules define ascension, and transfers before it. It does not say "you cannot transfer", it does not stop me from transferring once I get 1000 GR points, it does not reject transfers back to me after I ascend, and there is nothing to suggest from previous people's ascensions that what I choose to do is a loophole in any way.

Because policing such a rule would be too difficult, it's only by logging a complete history of the IPs that Forum can stop multi-ing. How would he track this when you could easily relay the naq and troops through multiple common friends, short of my suggested block it would be too much work for Forum.

If you choose to take a mistaken view based on some false "spirit" or made up rules, then do it, but don't belittle me because of it.

You're also belittling me because of not taking short cuts.

noob

scrub

And you seem far more eager to resort to name calling.

You say that using a method to avoid starting from scratch is not lazy, but smart. Paying someone else to do all the leveling of a character for you in a MMORPG is therefore not lazy but smart in your eyes. If money is the issue then perhaps if they did it for free/some non-monetary exchange it would be fine with you.
Sorry to break it to you but there is a world outside SGW, and just because my arguements reference it doesn't make them "another pointless analogy which fails to have any relevency to the topic".

It also has no relevency because:
1) I have not paid anyone to play on my account.
2) Did not pay for this account already ascended or built up.
3) I have not paid for any naq or UU beyond the in-game market.

If money is the issue then perhaps if they did it for free/some non-monetary exchange it would be fine with you.

Please read before you type.

That is why it's irrelevant. Not because I think this or that is lazy, but because that's not what happens. If someone pays for their account, then whoopdedo, they have paid for their account, that's not what I've done, and not what is being discussed.

It has nothing to do with the money, it's taking a short cut, you really should bother to read what I type before you respond to it.

And yet it was perfectly acceptable for people to complain about PPT abuse then, but not for me (and others if you check around the forum) to complain about this. Look up the word hypocrite.

A person who professes beliefs and opinions that he does not hold.

I have not said my stance on PPT beyond "until it was changed it was part of the game", I don't know how you fathom that i'm a hypocrite from this, but I guess when you are struggling for an argument, you can just invent things. Again, maybe think of something intelligent rather than just pulling a word and saying "look it up".

I'm not arguing that you were anti-PPT, I'm saying that it was ok for others to be such so it's ok for me to be anti-pre-ascention-troop/naq-stashing, regardless of how you wish to defend it. If you want to compare intelligence IQ 135 out of 150 when it was tested 2 years ago (100 is the average), top 1% of the Irish population in learning ability when tested in secondary school. Spent 4 summers at C.T.Y.I. (Centre for Talented Youth Ireland). So you can drop that arguement as you still keep arguing that a loophole is necessarily illegal in spite of being told that it's not via a dictionary definition.

The worst thing I've called you was lazy and yet you escalate to "noob". Tax evasion is smart (as long as you don't get caught) and a lazy way to get richer, am I a "noob" for not trying that?

Boo hoo, have a cry, you call me lazy for not wanting to start from scrath (as the game allows me to do within the rules), and I call you a noob because you are one. A noob\scrub will always be a noob\scrub until they can shed their fake rules that only they play with.

Gee, more name calling and slagging off, running out of decent arguements yourself?

Don't blame the shooters at Columbine, blame the guns for allowing them to kill people?

Yes, because we are clearly discussing American Gun Laws, and how they apply in the modern world. I'm sorry, but this IS another pointless analogy, because you have completly wrong.

Anyways, I'll tear apart this one for free.

I say "Don't blame the game if players are able to ascend twice in a month, and then they go ahead and do that".

Which you have changed into:

Don't blame the killers (players), if the guns (game\transfers) enable them to commit murder (fast reascension).

Clearly, this is a false statement. Their is more than one reason why they committed those murders, including their mental state, the society in which they were raised (and how they were raised), and yes, access to guns.

So you do things because SGW tells you to? It has nothing to do with your mind and the society within SGW, hmm, I think any psychologist might love to have a study of you.

Now, add the fact that murder is illegal (within reason obviously, but this was murder), and transferring this before ascension is not.

Hence, as I said, a more black and white issue. Something only becomes illegal after it's decided as such by those in power.

So yeah, it's another flawed analogy. I am starting to question your IQ, because you continue to come up with this false and irrelvant crap to support your flawed argument.

And I question yours as you can't learn the definition of a simple word, having to be repeatedly be reminded that loophole does not equate to illegal, I keep having to restate my points due to your inability to read before you type, your pitiful inability to reason anything out unless it's specifically in terms of SGW and you seem far more reliant on name calling.

Until Forum decides to make transfering and fast reascension illegal (easy way is to make you have to use everything you have to ascend)

You mean like it is now, hmm...
I think what you mean it that they must ascend without ever having transferred things to other accounts, seems even more drastic than my suggestion that they can't recieve anything from other players after ascending does it not?

The only thing I've been able to think of would be to prevent all reciepts of player to player transfers on the main SGW A/Cs of those who have ascended, and I have suggested such while also pointing out the flaw; too many people would complain though at the loss of this part of SS as they rely too much upon it.

Okay, keep trying then, until you provide a viable alternative, nothing is going to change, so why insult players who choose to play within the proper rules of the game. It's not illegal, so do not treat it as such.

I've never said it was illegal.

Honestly, i'm over this, so I'm finished posting here regarding this matter, I just don't have the time to continually destroy someone's weak arguments and false analogies when the issue is already defined as legal and not a "loophole".

Yet I tear apart your arguements with ease and still have the energy to keep going, feeling a little inadequate? Let me know when you come up with a decent arguement and learn to think through an analogy before you simply dismiss it just because it references the real world.