Ascended cap

[Nostradamus]

There is nothing that can be done even by 1000 people to descend a sniper.

Let's assume the sniper account is watched non-stop .... he is left with no weapons and he is turn farmed by 3-4 people in order to be 100% sure he doesn't get any dmu.

But as you know those 9 planets in attack can't be eliminated in any way ..... so all he has to do is convert some turns into dmu and buy 1 attack weapon. Again you can't destroy that 1 weapon. Then all he has to do is to farm inactive people and convert the few trils into life force and he is safe.
Even with 10-12 people watching the account if he uses 2 tabs or 2 windows he is bound that in a couple of tries to make the conversion.

Even if ... by some extremely lucky circumstances he is on the verge of being descended he can go on vacation mode ..... then return, farm and get his life force back to max.




Raising the 2 bil cap will only help snipers as it has been explained in some previous posts.

Removing the cap will animate the server for a while and will greatly reduce the sniper's power, but after a while the gap between the older or very active accounts and the new or not so active accounts will become extremely large ..... much more then it was a while back.

The main thing that helps snipers is the damn 130% rank modifier. If this was to be removed or only the over 100% part removed from the equation things will greatly improve.



The new accounts crying they can't grow because of the 5x rules is crap. By doing a decent ascension, even the first one and by decent I mean at least 5 mil APP you can get over 2.5 mil lf / turn in flow so 2.5 bil dmu / turn. In 1 week that's 840 bil dmu, enough to buy close to 30k fleets. That means that in 1 month he can be on it's own at 100 mil planets without 1 single attack. Once he's there he can buy some dmu and in another month he is at 1 bil planets .... with some farming or some more buying in another month he is at 2 bil planets.

The ascended server is on for a bit more then 3 years ... any new ascended account can get to the cap in 3 months or even less ..... considering that the top accounts needed about 5x that time I would say it's very reasonable.

[~Insider Trader~]

I concur with Nostradamus regarding noob accounts. With my new account I only did a 36k UP and a 49k UP ascention to get started. My 3rd one didn't make much of a diff and my 4th bought 1/4 of 1 charisma level. In 9 weeks I blew through the cap at 92mill/day without buying dmu and without snipering. A week later I'm now at 107 reduced to 70. It's not difficult.

Day 1 you convert turns to dmu
Day 2 you convert Lifeforce to dmu
Day 3 you start farming

The main thing that helps snipers is the damn 130% rank modifier. If this was to be removed or only the over 100% part removed from the equation things will greatly improve.

I think I said that a year ago. And I'm not the only one. Please admin, junk it and consign it to the SGW scrapheap.

[Lore]

While I agrre the 130% rank mod is foolish, and has been shown to be so since its inception, and I love the senerio you provide to show how impossible deascention is,,,,,,

Neither is the real problem, and neither will fix ascended, tho make deascention possible would go a long way tward making it better.

[martin the great]

stopping deascention in ascended would be like forcing 2 football teams to score the exact same amount of goals
it will defeat the entire point of the ascended server

[Nostradamus]

While I agrre the 130% rank mod is foolish, and has been shown to be so since its inception, and I love the senerio you provide to show how impossible deascention is,,,,,,

Neither is the real problem, and neither will fix ascended, tho make deascention possible would go a long way tward making it better.

Yes, as a long term solution it's nor. But think about it for a short term .... (I'm gonna exclude fremen from the general term "snipers" as he has about 50 quad more invested in attack level) .... most snipers have around 1300 attack and in order to break the big defenses which are around 30 quad and more need 350 mil attack planets, that's 1.75 bil planets trained. This is with the 130% modifier.

Without it they would need 450 bil, that's 2.25 bil planets. Don't rush and say they can make those 500 mil in 1 day cause it's not that simple. Beside the attack planets a snipers needs when farming to have either some form of defense (2-3 quad) so that people don't steal back the dmu or a decent covert in order that people don't see how much they have out. The latest is prefered because if people can see that the sniper is farming and he can't do nothing against him he might alert someone who can. In some cases they get both a defense and covert. What that means is that a sniper would need an additional 200-300 mil planets for this. But the one thing that any sniper needs when farming is to have good assassination or else he might find himself without a strike after just a few attacks. That's another 300-400 mil planets.

So with the 130% modifier a sniper would need around 2.2-2.5 bil planets and without it 2.7-3 bil. But, from 2 bil to 3 bil the CER drops by about 50% .... so by removing the cap this would ad 2 more days of recovering for most snipers. Furthermore, without the 130%, people will be more willing to build even bigger defenses because they can not be assassinated so easily.

Now how much would it take to implement this ? I would say 20-30 min maximum. All admin has to do is make the code lines that define the rank modifier as comments in attack.php. That's it .... simple and very fast.

The problem with descention is that the difficulty of descending someone and the effect in main have NEVER, NEVER since descension came into play been "syncronised". So if descension is hard the effects on main are servere and if it's easy then the effects are mild.

The effects as they are are very very light ..... of the 14 days people can spend 8 or more in PPT .... giving the size of most accounts they would lose from income 2-3 tril, maybe 4 tril in this time .... and they make that in maximum 2 days.

Descension has always been difficult .... even in the beginning when people cried because they were a few super accounts, but they didn't think that at 1 turn every 30 min those super accounts would only be able to descend someone every other week ... and after 15-20 people would of been descended the other would of had the time to invest and protect themselves.

Then it came the trick with low max life force level and high flow which made descension impossible .... then the big update which after a while made descension nearly impossible again.

Now how much time do you think Admin needs to balance this ? He has to redo the formulas, implement them in beta, wait for feedback, make adjustments and then go live. Judging from the past updates I would say this would take at least a few months.

[Lore]

Sorry but I think your over complicating it and the removal of the 130% rank mod will not slow them in the least. Generally there is not enough activity in ascended for snipers to even care about much covert or assasination. They finish their farming run in 1, at most 2 turns and are gone long before anyone reacts.

Will it cost them more planets? Yes

Will it truely change anything? NO

JMO

decension is the only way to change things.

[Nostradamus]

Lore you kind of contradict yourself. I presented earlier a scenario to prove that descension is impossible atm and you agreed with it, but you say that descension is the answer to the sniper problem.

I'm sorry but I don't see a way to change ascension in order to make the snipers descendable. Such a mesure can not be implemented in 10 minutes and since admin will say so the snipers will have plenty of time to farm 20-30 quad dmu or even more and drop them in what levels they need .... not that they don't already have better levels.

So how do you think a group of people can descend fremen ... I'm quite curious to see your answer.

[Lore]

Lore you kind of contradict yourself. I presented earlier a scenario to prove that descension is impossible atm and you agreed with it, but you say that descension is the answer to the sniper problem.

I'm sorry but I don't see a way to change ascension in order to make the snipers descendable. Such a mesure can not be implemented in 10 minutes and since admin will say so the snipers will have plenty of time to farm 20-30 quad dmu or even more and drop them in what levels they need .... not that they don't already have better levels.

So how do you think a group of people can descend fremen ... I'm quite curious to see your answer.

You misunderstood me

Right now as the game stands every account in the game acting in unison can not take down Freman, nor any other active account. Deascention is not achievable presently.

My statement that Deascention is the answer, was saying that it has to be made possible. being able to force them from the ascended realm is the only way to stop a 1 stat wonder.

So let me rephase my statement,

Making deascention possible is the only answer to snipers.

I don't care if i win or loose the ascended battle, just so long as I actually have means by witch to fight, and they do not exist presently.

[Nostradamus]

Snipers have stopped for quite a while to be 1 stat wonders.

Don't forget that ascension has an exponential growth rate. I'm sure you remember when JUAN massed down UTA and they couldn't do nothing against him .... it's a similar situation, a very very good account can not be harmed by many decent accounts.

I'm think the situation has gone too far and I haven't seen a suggestion that can change the ascended battle and allow snipers to be descended even by having lots of accounts trying to .... the difference in levels is just too big and it gets bigger every day.

In order to really make descention possible there game as it is now has to change at a basic level ... as I said don't know how but no suggestion or a couple of them together can achive that.

You noticed that admin puts less and less time in the game .... franckly I see his side, he gets enough $$$ as things are and a change in ascended which means many hours of work might not help with the income .... people who don't care at all about this server might quit if they find themselves descended again and again (not that they don't deserve it).

So I doubt admin wants it ..... on the other hand if he were to change the rank modifier to go against snipers ..... so they get 60% insted of 130% things will change for a while. But if that time isn't used to think and implement a REAL solution ... then the game will die.

[Lore]

But if that time isn't used to think and implement a REAL solution ... then the game will die.

[Brdavs]

Its beyond "fixing", differences are to great. in its conception the gameplay was too fast. This is the fate that awats main aswell, only it is "aging" slower due to the fact one cant have 380mil UPs. But gaps are still growing and its detremental.

Reset. Its the only way. And make it slower, not faster. For ascended that is 100% true, and for main, its not far off either at this stage heh.

[Lore]

Its beyond "fixing", differences are to great. in its conception the gameplay was too fast. This is the fate that awats main aswell, only it is "aging" slower due to the fact one cant have 380mil UPs. But gaps are still growing and its detremental.

Reset. Its the only way. And make it slower, not faster. For ascended that is 100% true, and for main, its not far off either at this stage heh.

I always said ascended was way to fast. It should have been much slower and more mathodical. Ascention growing faster then main made so extremely low cost in cross server trading and it should have been the exact opposite

[Lithium]

remove or reduce to 30-60min the gap between 2 ascended attack and yall will see big guys dropping like pops, not everyone but mnany will fall that way.

snipers will that way too. fro 14 days

RESULT: if a Big Dog will be desc or fear that might get desc 2-3 times in 2 months (while in war) he aint going to spend $$$

Prove: are the latest updates, MS's now can take down all planets, which were founding the Big Dogs.

teh game earn money from the main not from ascended.

[Memento]

gonna revive this please remove the caps on planet amounts

its driving me nuts

[Juliette]

gonna revive this please remove the caps on planet amounts

its driving me nuts

Agreed!!

Or change it again, make it more loose.. like eh.. much higher.