Mining - Or how to keep battles worth it

[Sleipnir]

We've seen a couple of times that in the long run, battle is no longer worth it. The main reason behind this is the link between untrained units and income. As you fight, you lose units, and as you lose units you need to train more, which costs you untrained units and lowers your income. Eventually, it's no longer worth it. Up to now, the answer has always been to increase production per unit, so there would be more naquadah in the open. The problem is, you lose even more income over the long run because of this fix. So, how can this be fixed?

What needs to be done is slightly detaching income from military. Basically, not all untrained should produce income anymore. To reach this goal, you could have a stat named mining capacity that is upgraded in a manner similar to unit production. The mining capacity is the maximum number of units that can provide naquadah. If you're over the limit, losing units won't matter all that much. So, losing units will be much less of a factor in long term profit.

A second benefit of this approach is that you can finally implement the unit production bonus for one of the races without too much of a balance problem. More units no longer means more income per se. It means more units to waste on attacks, sabotage, the fun stuff

An example (hypothetical stats):
I have a unit production of 300
I have a mining capacity of 10000 units.
I have 9800 units.

Right now, I have 10000 mining capacity, so I could send 10000 units into the mines. But I only have 9800 untrained, so my income is 9800*40=392000, or 490000 for a goa'uld.
By tomorrow this time, I'll have 10100 units. I can send 10000 into the mines and get a turn income of 400k, or 500k for goa'uld. The extra 100 units are just sitting there, doing nothing, so I could just as well train them for some other task. I won't notice a change in income.

[sciguy]

hmm.. this idea I like. If this gets implemented, I finally see myself using my own units again for fighting, instead of just using mercs all the time.

[TheoX]

yeah and it be great old fun

[Lord Dougy]

i don't like this idea coz i like my high income with loads of troops.

[Shai_hulud]

I like this idea, but shouldn't by extension guald get cheaper mining levels?

[Saturnine]

It would put yet another damper on untrained "trades". But resourceful traders will upgrade the mining "capacity". Its a good idea I believe. Maybe we can give extra income bonus to the Replicators as I have pushed for in the past. OR, the wraith if they are implemented?

[Apocalypse.]

I don't like the idea i use mercs for my fighting even when i get excited and use up 500 turns i don't lose a cent on income i don't use my untrained for fighting period except for super soilders This mining capcity only means one more boring Economic aspect like Up that u have to spend money on rember all we are playing a WAR game enough encomic stuff already .

[Saturnine]

I like this idea, but shouldn't by extension guald get cheaper mining levels?

Makes sense!!

[Shai_hulud]

Also, I think some people wanted minning mercanaries, but it was unbalanced because of exponetial growth. If there were a cap, then mining mercs might not be so unbalanced if they didn't produce as much as normal units. Or maybe they would. Just a thought.

[scben]

i love this idea cause it put more emphasis on attacking for naq than just building a huge army. however i think that there should be a way to incease your capacity for mining maybe some upgrades as follows
everyone starts with capacity for 10,000
1st upgrade allows for 20,000 capacity cost 20,000,000
2nd upgrade allows for 40,000 capacity cost 40,000,000
3rd and finally upgrade allows for 60,000 capacity cost 80,000,000

i think that this would also work cause people would still use the extra untrained men for attacking and sabs but would also allow people that have played for a while to still have an advantage. however i have a ton of men now with a big production so this would really make all the naq i use for production worthless but i am willing to do that in order to make the game better as a whole which i think that this would do

[NoDot]

I don't like the idea i use mercs for my fighting even when i get excited and use up 500 turns i don't lose a cent on income i don't use my untrained for fighting period except for super soilders This mining capcity only means one more boring Economic aspect like Up that u have to spend money on rember all we are playing a WAR game enough encomic stuff already .

What's wrong with economics? War should be important, but shouldn't the (extremely) economic-strtegic do as well and the greatest warriors? (and that should be very hard, BTW-it's too easy now)

[Lord_Zeus]

its not a badly concieved idea sleipnir, but I dont think it is that good an idea, I think that an idea suggested in a previous topic about introducing planets into the game with a resource limit on them etc may be a better idea, as then attack means increasing your income, rather than instant naqadah bonus.

[Apocalypse.]

I don't like the idea i use mercs for my fighting even when i get excited and use up 500 turns i don't lose a cent on income i don't use my untrained for fighting period except for super soilders This mining capcity only means one more boring Economic aspect like Up that u have to spend money on rember all we are playing a WAR game enough encomic stuff already .

What's wrong with economics? War should be important, but shouldn't the (extremely) economic-strtegic do as well and the greatest warriors? (and that should be very hard, BTW-it's too easy now)

startgate WARS not stargate econmics it's boring war is fun and entertaining econmics are just boring Tht is just my own personal opion

[Sleipnir]

Actually, strange as it may sound, this change should make the economics of war a lot easier. If you can take loss of income out of the equation, there will be a lot more battling to do. Which will be good for the WAR part.

[IcER]

Personally I dont think this is neccessary to make attack profitable. If this was put I forsee everyone convert their surplus troops into spies thus making it HARDER for war, as everyone has more spies kicking around, so higher covert defences nad therefore big losses in each sabotage etc...

It is still perfectly profitable to attack profitably late on in the game, the main issue arises when mercs arent being replenished as fast as they are dying and you cant arm all your weapons...but similar things would happen with this mining in place.

Quick question..how would you increase your mining cap? Or will this set everyone to an upper limit income wise?

Personally I dont think this idea floats all that well, but I am often wrong