Modication of current war fighting.

[High Empty]

This isn't in order, someone wants to fix it up BY ALL MEANS

Loss of NOX benefits during declared war has made it so that no one wants to declare war, either individually or as an alliance. This makes damage counters worthless (they could use some enhancement anyway) and makes it difficult to destroy or sab your enemy if they remain phased which is not fair to those who have invested heavily in covert and covert levels.

-and-

Super alliances have formed (CoP/CiA) which have caused top-heavy loading, feelings of frustration by players and alliances outside of these groups, and bad feelings. Neutral alliances or players cannot be trusted to remain neutral.

-and-

Wars can last forever with no clear end in sight and no clear winner.




Solution

The solution would require a change to the game rules which I've split into a few parts:


Ok, say war is declared! NOX/ ALLAINCE WAR

1. When two alliances or individuals declare war, NOX benefits do not go away as long as you are not attacking anyone. As soon as you attack/raid/sab someone, NOX is turned off automatically.
a. NOX protection disappears! Attacks are 50% stronger between the warring alliances. All stats can be reduced to zero by massing!

b. All alliance members suffer reduced income/reduced power against non-war targets/some other penalty for being involved in war.

c. Any member in a warring alliance may drop out of the war at any time by confirming they want to leave (via a seperate menu, like where the password change is), however, if say 60% of the alliance do this, the alliance loses the war. You could have a "spoils of war", for example, the winning alliance gets a % of the cost of the damage inflicted on the oppocite alliance. Say alliance A inflicts 500 mill uu and 100 tril naq worth of losses on Alliance B. Alliance A wins, and gets a % of the damage inflicted back as a "reward"! Additionally, the losing alliance suffers a short penalty, eg 120hr reduced income or some other penalty for losing

d. NOX benefits cannot be turned on until 24 hours have passed since your last attack (on anyone), your last vacation, or your last PPT.

e.If you declare war on someone or your alliance/commander declares all out war, you cannot transfer to or receive resources from anyone in the game outside of your alliance (transfer and trade broker is disabled), although gamemarket is still permitted with your three market turns. (and no trading between alliance members who have opted out of/left the war).

f. Allaince members can't rejoin for the duration of the war, and an allaicne can't take on new members.

2. You cannot attack someone unless you declare war first (attack/raid/sab/etc buttons are all disabled when you're at peace or neutral) ( peace you can't even recon) (Neutral you can Recon)

A war is declared automaticly, if 2 or more players are massed by the same allaince.


Benefits

1. Your alliance goes to war and you weren't ready so you put yourself on NOX and don't attack anyone. Your NOX benefits remain until you attack someone at which point you are unable to return to NOX protection for 24 hours. You can still be attacked by the enemy, of course (up to the point of being phased), but it keeps you from being unexpectedly and completely destroyed. This way, you have a small window of time to prepare if needed and you don't unfairly prevent your enemy from having their revenge if you attack them.

2. Wars would never last forever because your ability to transfer resources is disabled until you have set neutral or peace. That alone would force people to the bargaining table.

3. Alliances who declare war on each other would have to wage war without outside help because no resources could be transferred into or out of the warring alliance members.

Allaince War System (Damage).

1. Duration of War
a.5 day, the 10 day and the 15 day war system.
b.After wards ther is a forced 5 day (min) and max of 15 day no attacking from each alliance allaince commanders agree on this.

2.OK things that need to be included in the allaince damange screen.
a.Counts the units destroyed
i. Attackers
ii.Defenders
iii.Spies
iv.Anti Convert
v.Untrain units that have been raided
vi.Attack mercs
vii.Defence mercs
b. counts the weapons " large weapons" destroyed
i. Hugh
ii.Large
iii.Median
iv.Small
v.Tiny
vi.Very Tiny
c.Turns counted
i. Attack turns
ii.Sabbs
iii.Recons
d.Active naq costs
i. The cost of repairing weapons on attack and defence
ii.The amount of naq farmed
iii.sold weapons don't count
e.Total Naq estimated damage
i. This would be based on the Price of UU destroyed with each of the costs of the units included, along with the base amount fort the uu which is based off the average in a 30 day period on the black market, or for this case say 600mil per k. The Price of mercs and weapons is also included. The cost of the repairs is also added in on this, this is both on attack and defence. The Cost of turns shall also be incuded at a rate of 20 bil per k, based on the black market.


3. Hmm combining this with a shield (NOX) so that the allaince are forced to have protections from their counterparts counterparts
EX.. So say the legion and omega wared omega would have a sheild in place with the TF and the TA, and whoever else. The legion would have a sheild in play with DD/D12 DDE, and might be alpha as well. This would prevent those allies from helping out in the war, by the simple fact that neither could aide in recons or sabs, or much else.

NOX

Proposal:
Nox will still phase you out, but it will be based on percentage of destroyed def weapons not on used AT.
when you are activating nox the system will save your current def weapon armory status as 100%
the nox wont engage (phase you) as long the % of your def weapons isnt reaching a set percentage


what will be changed:
phasing
costs for having them activated
your weapons can not be destroyed when being on nox
AC loss ratio will be adjusted to reflect the def
strike/defence efficency is being adjusted


the armory % of your def weapons would be related to your nox/defcon setting :

for example:
only nox ( + none defcon) means: 100% - 1 %=> your armory can be damaged up to 99%, this means you wont loose your weapons totally but can repair them (see repair point) when getting online again

nox +low means : 100%-10% => 90% damage can be done
nox + medium : 100 - 25% => 75% damage at max
nox + high : 100 - 50% => 50% damage at max
nox + critical : 100 - 75% => 25% damage at max
no nox + defcon => time delay (10-60 secs between attack) + cover bonus

=> this will effectively make the def weapons undestroyable, makign nox worth to activate



price changes:
nox and defcon levels are getting very expensive in return
changing the nox/defcon elvel should cost

- nox will no longer cost income but UP. 10% of your total UP will be lost per turn while nox is on & 1 G/R point
(reasoning, you not only have to mantain your soldiers and miners but also the NOX personal you hired -> less resources to feed new recruits )

-defcon will decrease your income by the percentage they add to protection so,

low - 10% of your income per turn
medium - 25% of your income per turn
high - 50% of your income per turn
critical - 75% of your income per turn


Additional facts related to nox & defcon setting:

- while having hired the nox you CANNOT attack/spy or sab anyone
- your defcon also boosts the power of your defence. atm your defence can vary from 75-100% of its total action
having decon level "none" wills till do that, BUT low defcon level will lower the % range from
80-100%
medium to 85% - 100%
high to 90% - 100%
critical to 95% - 100%
(this will make the defcon level even more important since its indicates your defence prepardness)

-at the same time, while your def is increased exactly the opposite effect will be apply for your attack strike
so being at none defcon gives ya strike a 95- 100% to have full power, critical only 75-100%

- when def weapons are being sabbed their total hitpoints are gone => lowering the percentage of the total def armory % by that amount (so sabbing a def weapons raises the percentage count and phases the sabbed player eventually)
- in return there will be NO limit of cover activities against a player, when the player is phased out, he can still be sabbed, but only his attack weapons (nox arent protecting these).
- reparing your def or unchecking and rechecking nox policy of coruse resets the %-meter.
- new bought def weapons raise raise the current % health
- important; every 24 hours the nox will automatically check your armory and reset stats!
Anti cover action:
having standing defs needs a change in the anti cover actiona s well!
cover/ac actions are not liked by the nox either so they wont interfer, even worser they will not even protect cover units!
the remaining def wont add up to the defenders covert action, but the % that is lowering the defenders attack strike/def also affects the cover power.

- its simply (attackers AC power *[1+-%]) vs (defenders cover power* [1+-%])
- both, AC and cover units will die in this battle! there will no longer be no casualties on either side. having no def or having way more ac units doesnt mean the cover units cant fight back, neither the other way round.
- the exact percentage of casualties should be similar to the current loss rate, while and way higher cover or ac action lowers the losses of course (but they will never be 0!).
- since no def weapons are affected (and no attack weapons either), noone will ahve repair costs and therfor also no %-loss in armory.


the MS

the motherships arent affected either by the nox. their usuage will be as usually -but defcon might change their attack/def stats as well





adjusting of nox&defcon level and other calculations (not so lil game update suggested here but will balance the game imo!!)

despite the intension, nox and defcon level is not protecting anything but leeching your resources.
you need 42 attacks against you till you phase out being protected from further attacks till next turn.
now, common knowledge is, that EVERY def (no matter how big it is) can be massed down to nothing in 20-35 attacks easily (if the attackers strike is higher) and even that can be done within a few mins -if not secs.
so the only real use of nox is lowering the income, and maybe prevents you from getting comletely ac-ed after your def has been destroyed.

in my opinion the nox/defcon setting needs a change that takes the defence stats into account -instead of being based on AT used against someone.
therfor we would need to change a few more settings a bit.
ive started this after doing some research of stuff that is imo not the best solution atm.



a little summary:
Now, taken that a lot of player will use this feature to protect their defs and a lot who managed to follow my thoughts are now preparing to flame me for giving the defenders a huge advantage but think about it!

taken, defs will survive, but noxed players cant do any offensive actions, the upkeep costs are huge -not only income but also UP! (while attack is cheaper to repair and also benefits from ahving none defcon/nox)
repairing the damaged def is expensive, with nox resetting itself every 24h it is possible to destroy a hostile def almost completely even him being on nox+critical every day.

ac action will now be more troop expensive but ppl will also no longger be able to build up some fake defenses to prevent you from doing it.
cover activities will not be limited anymore (only by attacks cover turns), on the other hand, def weapons will be protected whe being phased and the defcon/nox raise your coverty against sabbings anyway.



In the end these is only one concept to make the game more balanced and to even out some disadvantages(might even say loopholes) that currently existing in the game. and i know, im touching some old features

if you find any big mistakes or glitches in my logic, got a helpful comment or question feel free to post. if you vote no, please state why, maybe we can think of some ways to fix it.


LOL well i've stolen alot of stuff from here and there hopes that helps a bit.

[Alabrax]

I have not read all of that but I might suggest that this be split up in to a few different posts simply because there are so much to talk about here.

[Lord_Zeus]

Agree with Alabrax there... but

1. When two alliances or individuals declare war, NOX benefits do not go away as long as you are not attacking anyone. As soon as you attack/raid/sab someone, NOX is turned off automatically.

I agree.... but I think this should mabye be just not in wars... or mabye a nox counter to 10... gives you like 10 attacks and goes down like phasing.. if its over 10 nox wont help you

[Kit-Fox]

this is I assume a continuation of the thread in the GC by ETL well I said it in there

I try to avoid threads like these but,

ETL > Laws of War??? Were you smoking something when you decided to write this? I ask because as you should be very well aware of not even the UK troops keep to em & we are supposed to most anal army in the world about it.

Laws never do work as ppl do & will find loopholes in even the most well written laws & regulations, not to mention people bending the meaning of the words & then there is of course deliberate misunderstanding & outright denial.

Who would you have police these rules? I rl we have the UN council, in SGW something like that wouldnt work (much like it doesnt in rl, cause of vetos etc)

Best that ppl are forced to settle their differences by talking rather than trying to force a war to conclusion by might. remember ww2? Its seeds were sown at the end of ww1 when we destroyed Germany and left it like that. This kinda of suggestion is highly similar to that, destory & leave. it breeds anger & feelings of revenge, given how ppl feel about their accoutns already this wouldnt be helpful

And I'm gonna say it again changing the rules wouldnt work as there is no independant ability to police it.

Not to mention that the idea about not been able to do anything while at neutral is just plain silly. Lots of things in rl happen when the two countries are at what in sgw would be a neutral relationship.

Also lots of wars have gone on for years and at the end no clear winner can be established as both have lost so much, thats how wars work, they destroy both sides. there is no winner. requiring the game to need a winner as such kinda paints the wrong idea about warfare as a whole & risks making ppl attack simply for a win for the smallest of reasons even more so than they do already

[Tok`ra]

Better yet, just scrap nox all together.

Hers the tech tree of SGW updates

1 Whining for update to fix something
2 Add update to fix whining (nox)
3 whining over update
4 whining for update to fix soething (the update

[High Empty]

i'm not looking at enforcing any rules, or anything else, i'm looking at a better warfare system. Period.

WE want wars, somewhere in there is a way that wars can be tabulated so that the total damn in (naq) can be calutated and we can get a idea of who won a war.

Forgot to add in, that when your attacking someone or defending the naq you use on repairs also should be added into the total allaince war system just to keep things blanced.

As for being too long but ofcourse we aren't looking for a solution to an uncomplated problem, such as getting rid of nox won't solve any of the problems, person i don't find nox to be a problem, a pain but that's about it.

When i'm not still hungover i'll redo that above list and place it insome sort of order at the moment It's what i demeed important from the other threads i look at, now i didn't include Ston stuff, will do at somepoint most likely.

[Tok`ra]

Dammage is irrelvent in a war.

In hte end, it comes down to who is willing to keep fighting, and who surrenders.

[High Empty]

Dammage is irrelvent in a war.

In hte end, it comes down to who is willing to keep fighting, and who surrenders.

i'm not giving them the choice tok'ra, think about it.

They can't get resouces outside their allaince. A that will end it quickly

B They can only fight a war for a MAX of 15 days, then there a 5 days COOL down period.

Thinking stongly of no PPT while on this war kick.

Damage is so that people can really tell if they are winning a war, or if they are getting their ass kicked.

[Tok`ra]

People sell stats in war too.

And no supplies ?

Ever heard of running a blockade ?

[High Empty]

People sell stats in war too.

And no supplies ?

Ever heard of running a blockade ?

meh ever here of Stockpiling, and yes there still is blockade running of both UU and naq. BUT no blockcade running of turns.

see people can put out 1 TRil and say here attack me for it
or put out 25M uu and say here raid me for it, but they can't give them more turns.

[Tok`ra]

People sell stats in war too.

And no supplies ?

Ever heard of running a blockade ?

meh ever here of Stockpiling, and yes there still is blockade running of both UU and naq. BUT no blockcade running of turns.

see people can put out 1 TRil and say here attack me for it
or put out 25M uu and say here raid me for it, but they can't give them more turns.

People will find a way .

[Aegidius]

1) The damage:
I like the idea of turning the Damage Calculator into a real measure of war considering the naq lost by both sides. And also the idea of using the market rates to turn uu into naq to calculate the damage in units lost. Here the mercs could also be added at their current cost. The only problem I see with this is that market rates change and therefor the damage could oscilate until the end of the war.

2) The implications of WAR

As I said in the other thread remotion of PPT and NOX effect are a fair result of WAR. (This should apply when both alliance accept the war and only for the alliances in war. For the rest of the server nothing has changed). This even make scence in the StarGate Universe. How could the NOX or the Asgard protect u when u are in fact declaring war to the other alliance?. Alliance-alliance wars should be taken more seriously so if u don't want to lose this kind of stuff stay out of the alliance until the war is over.

> Now about the restriction in all P2P transfer outside the war it will drastically reduce the time of the wars. say u have 30 members fighting. Then each week each player can produce a maximum of (48*7+ 400*15) = 6336 turns/player = 905 turns/player/day. Of course automatic disable of the "accept now members" function should be added or this would be pointless.

I think I like this. Is not a modern war but the old kind of battle when armies meet in the battlefield and all the damage is made face to face.

All for now. More comments later

[High Empty]

ok updated, Keep forgetting to add things, like how to enforce the no trades BTW i don't mind letting people farm or Raid for resouces out side of their allaince during war, as another way to trade, They don't get turns in so that's a major thing. Another thing would be if they can farm or raid, THEY can be farmed or raided while farming or raiding.

OH and something about increasing the turn CAP to 50k

[Thufir_Hawat]

Dammage is irrelvent in a war.

In hte end, it comes down to who is willing to keep fighting, and who surrenders.

I agree with Tok'ra, more often than not, when he makes a real post.

We do not need rules that benefit those with 80M armies etc..

We all know there are economies of scale, the larger you are the more extra Naq you have to wage war etc....

ETL and High Empty are trying to get the game to change to favor their current positions.

This war could end any day by either side agreeing, Instead many want it to end on the COP side but are unwilling to surrender.

Instead they prefer to sell their accounts, go on permanent Vacation, move to a Neutral Alliance or propose new RULES OF WAR and have Forum code them in.

Just so they can say they didn't surrender.

Those that have Surrendered openly, to me are much more Honorable than all those that are working to change the rules to benefit themselfs or hide in sanctuary without admitting defeat.

Wars are dirty, first strikes are spectacular always, but finishing takes times and determination.

[Alabrax]

Dammage is irrelvent in a war.

In hte end, it comes down to who is willing to keep fighting, and who surrenders.

i'm not giving them the choice tok'ra, think about it.

They can't get resouces outside their allaince. A that will end it quickly

B They can only fight a war for a MAX of 15 days, then there a 5 days COOL down period.

Thinking stongly of no PPT while on this war kick.

Damage is so that people can really tell if they are winning a war, or if they are getting their ass kicked.

Just from what you say here it looks like you are describing changes that would shift the power in the game back to only the super accounts.

Can you explain how this would benefit all the players of the game please?